Is baking only within the envelopes faster?

HitmonInfinity

Maya question:

When using Transfer Maps, under "advanced options" there are three options for search method:

Closest to Envelope
Search for target meshes outside the envelope.

Inside Envelope then Outside Envelope
Search inside and outside the envelope for target meshes.

Inside Envelope Only
Search only inside the boundary of the envelope for target meshes.

Do these options affect baking time? If i choose inside then out, it usually turns out fine, but I'm wondering if it takes longer to bake than if it only searched within the envelope.

cmtanko

from what I see is MAYA's bake isn't that good... I had also been trying do a good bake for my tank, dnt do any good but after I tried it in 3DMax it gave it lot better result. I'd rather suggest, xNormal(if you have lesser mesh and no exploding required) or 3DMax's render to texture option. (I maybe wrong but this is from my personal experience)

HitmonInfinity

I use xnormals for AO, but I like to keep things in maya when doing the normals. Exploded meshes are a lot easier to work with when they're key framed

I probably should make the switch though.... maya takes forever.

cmtanko

okay, I got a reply from another forum member in my thread... He says

"I don't think it's the fault of Maya / xNormal. You should assign the good smoothing group to the mesh in order to have a proper baking. The result of the bake in Max will be the same, as long as you don't assign the right smoothing groups. This should help.
http://wiki.polycount.com/NormalMap?...ect=Normal+Map"


maybe you shld also read this, though I havent gone though it but will check it soon... it shld help...

rollin

that a maya bake is worse then one from max is a myth

Ace-Angel

They're all bad if not synched to the engine at the end of the day. So take it for what you will.

However, if you don't have overlapping UV's (apart from mirrored ones) then yes, caged will be fine.

onionhead_o

theres a chance that your ao won't match your normal maps. i would say maya gives a cleaner bake than max although it takes longer. I like Xnormal for its speed. but i never get the results i want out of it, I only use it if i have to.

EarthQuake

rollin wrote: »

that a maya bake is worse then one from max is a myth

Right, a Maya bake displayed in Maya's viewport is actually much higher quality than a Max bake displayed with default Max viewport shaders.

Ace-Angel wrote: »

They're all bad if not synched to the engine at the end of the day. So take it for what you will.

Yep.

However, if you don't have overlapping UV's (apart from mirrored ones) then yes, caged will be fine.

Not sure what you mean here?

Ace-Angel

For example, in xNormal, if you have overlapping UV's (like say my guns magazine, on my rifle's main body) xNormal actually will take longer in baking maps (especially cavity, ao, etc...) HOWEVER, if you follow the usual method of mirror UV's, make sure welded tangents and offset the UV's, then it will bake normally with no problem.

This happens (the slow down) when cages are involved, ray cast doesn't slow it down in this case, but a clean mesh and proper UV's WITH A CAGE is faster naturally.

It's an xNormal thing, I don't think Maya and Max have the same issues.

HitmonInfinity

I think we're getting off topic here. I bake my normals in maya.... they turn out well. Does anyone know if it's worth spending time making the envelopes nice or should i just set it to "inside then out?"

EarthQuake

HitmonInfinity wrote: »

I think we're getting off topic here. I bake my normals in maya.... they turn out well. Does anyone know if it's worth spending time making the envelopes nice or should i just set it to "inside then out?"

I doubt this will have much effect on performance but maybe?. It would be easy enough for you to bake with the various options and simply time it. Really if "inside then out" provides the best results thats what you should use.

One of the biggest reasons that Maya is slow is that(atleast the version i used, 2008 ) is that baking was single threaded. Maybe they've updated this in newer versions? If so it might make sense to use an update version(if you're not)

Another that that makes a HUGE difference is deleting history when dealing with meshsmooth. Make sure to save a copy of your scene as this will permanently sub-divide your mesh, but it makes a masssssive difference in render speed. Its really a pain that you can't bake with the smooth preview thing.


At the end of the day baking is always going to take a while, its best to find some other task to do while running long bakes, get lunch, dinner, sleep, set up PSDS, etc etc. Also, make sure to do quick low quality bakes to check for errors before doing the full on final bake, this will save you from doing painful rebaking.

EarthQuake

Ace-Angel wrote: »

For example, in xNormal, if you have overlapping UV's (like say my guns magazine, on my rifle's main body) xNormal actually will take longer in baking maps (especially cavity, ao, etc...) HOWEVER, if you follow the usual method of mirror UV's, make sure welded tangents and offset the UV's, then it will bake normally with no problem.

This happens (the slow down) when cages are involved, ray cast doesn't slow it down in this case, but a clean mesh and proper UV's WITH A CAGE is faster naturally.

It's an xNormal thing, I don't think Maya and Max have the same issues.

Right right, if you don't offset your uvs you'll get a speed hit plus potentially errors from raytracing the same uvs twice(or more). This should apply to any app.

If your entire mesh was mirrored but the mirrored uvs weren't offset your bake would take 2x as long.

HitmonInfinity

EarthQuake wrote: »

I doubt this will have much effect on performance but maybe?. It would be easy enough for you to bake with the various options and simply time it. Really if "inside then out" provides the best results thats what you should use.

One of the biggest reasons that Maya is slow is that(atleast the version i used, 2008 ) is that baking was single threaded. Maybe they've updated this in newer versions? If so it might make sense to use an update version(if you're not)

Another that that makes a HUGE difference is deleting history when dealing with meshsmooth. Make sure to save a copy of your scene as this will permanently sub-divide your mesh, but it makes a masssssive difference in render speed. Its really a pain that you can't bake with the smooth preview thing.


At the end of the day baking is always going to take a while, its best to find some other task to do while running long bakes, get lunch, dinner, sleep, set up PSDS, etc etc. Also, make sure to do quick low quality bakes to check for errors before doing the full on final bake, this will save you from doing painful rebaking.

Yeah, I'm using 2011... still not multi-threaded

I actually just started keeping smooth in the history so i can easily go back, but I had no idea it was hurting my baking times! I'll just save before deleting the history from now on. Thanks for that tip!

EarthQuake

HitmonInfinity wrote: »

Yeah, I'm using 2011... still not mult-threaded

I actually just started keeping smooth in the history so i can easily go back, but I had no idea it was hurting my baking times! I'll just save before deleting the history from now on. Thanks for that tip!

Yeah and maybe this was some sort of bug in 2008, some weird memory leak or something. It seemed like the more I worked on the scene the worse it would get, I had times where a bake that should take about an hour was taking 8-16 hours!!! When I figured out the delete history thing I was soooo happy.