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sama.van
polycounter lvl 14
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sama.van polycounter lvl 14
Plop!


I remember a thread about the forum's feedback but it doesn't have any sticky on it! anyway...

Actually I'm little off on Polycount and didn't commit new stuff for some month...


In this thread I would like to give a personnal opinion about the forum structure.


Each days or often I will come on Polycount checking new 3D thread etc..
Sometimes more than one page, or 2 pages.

But I'm interested about low poly work for game production and most often for the very low poly work.
My range is arroung 1 poly to 2000 Poly for a 3D character and I'm not really interested about more polygons count, etc...

What I'm saying is I'm interesting about all kind of 3D work on the Game industry range, but I prefer something really low polycount.


This is my personnal feel only.


Anyway, I would like to know if I'm the only one the feel it, and if on Polycount it's tim to creat a :

- "Pimping and Previews Hi poly work"
- " Pimping and Previews Low poly work"

Or :

- " Pimping and Previews Old School"
- " Pimping and Previews next gen School"

and finally a "Pimping and Previews No category"


I know this is like a Troll subject, I don't wait any positive answer, but I was really hoping to give my feel in this thread.


If the multi " Pimping and Previews" section is not welcome, do you think there is some possibility to answer to some question when artist is creating a thread with some CheckBoxes like :

- Type of work :
Character
Background
Car
etc....

- Style :
realistic,
fantasy
comics
manga
etc....

- Polygon Range :
1-250
500-1000
1000 -2000
2000- 4000
etc..

- Textuee work :
Diffuse
diffuse + Normal
etc...

Platform :
Playstation 3 // 360 // Pc
Playstion 2 // xbox// PSP // iphone,
etc....

... and will help to use the search commant more often or creating a filter thread when I come arround ^_^

I'm really sorry for what I will say buyt actually the "Pimp and preview" section is "garbage" for everything and nothing.

Personnaly if there is a garbage section and I add my thread inside , all people will remember evrytime they will come in the garbage section, they can see my low poly and colored work.

And I won't be the only one, a friend gave to me this idea haha of garbage section because he is scare to add his very lowp oly work near the "Hipoly realistic black megaman looking an american guys" (Artist are scare sometimes... and then verylow poly artist start to go far away...)


I'm really sorry, my english is for sure broken then I will hope someone will understand my feel.


If someone know the Deviantart community, he already knows if they want some Realisitic//character// lowpoly// they can do a research quickly. and browse artist's work.

Let try it, this is very good :

http://www.deviantart.com/#catpath=gameart/3dgame&order=9

For that reason really lot of game artist started to create an account on Deviantart and will update it evrytime they created something new.

The game section is quite new, we really fight a lot for getting it!!!!
before Poser work was near the Maya work... anyway, this discussion is close right now :D


User of polycount 5 years ago was probably 20yo, today they have a familly and the geek life is on the end...

haha, it started for me, I don't have any time to browse a full forum, help people etc....
I'm sorry for that. But I'm probably not the only one!!! ^_^
Next geenration take care of the most new user, isn't it?


Anyway, I will stop here, I wait some feedback before to extend my feel..



My Best to all, here on Polycount ^_^
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Replies

  • ericdigital
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    ericdigital polycounter lvl 13
    Garbage!? how dare you!

    There is a low poly thread, I think that is good enough. Don't need a separate thread for every low poly piece unless of course an artist feel like they want to try and get more exposure/feedback.


    That's how Dad did it, that's how America does it... and it's worked out pretty well so far!

    /Ironman
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  • rollin
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    rollin polycounter
    hm.. we have the lowpoly thread and there's not so much aktion going on there

    but giving threads special tags isn´t a bad idear over all
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  • Wells
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    Wells polycounter lvl 18
    ha. a thread for all low poly? preposterous! would you guys settle for a thread for all high poly?


    I do miss seeing more lower poly stuff getting posted. Everyone's got a hard-on for zed brush. But this only makes sense, since companies are now looking for those skills. I don't think we need to split the P&P section up any more, though. Lower rez artists need to be proud of their work and post their shit!

    also, kids should be put to work as soon as the school year ends. they're everywhere, with their bikes and their loud music.
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    I dont think the forum structure needs changing, but the tag/flag idea is fantastic and, I think, a necessity.

    That way when opening the front page every user could even have some kind of personalized section (for instance : "UE3+environment") showing all the results of that search.

    This would also help making the search tool more efficient (polycount's search page is still one of the worse :P)

    I think we should also have thread icons just like conceptart.org.
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  • MoP
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    MoP polycounter lvl 18
    We have discussed a "tag" idea for a while in the background (kub, brome, EQ and myself). We haven't really had the time or resources to look into a proper implementation yet, though.
    It'd be really nice to have, it's just a matter of getting the stuff together, which is always easier said than done.
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  • bounchfx
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    bounchfx mod
    don't we have somewhat of a tag thing going on? I've noticed words to the right of some topic names with descriptions of what's inside.. I guess that's more for people to start using themselves though if they want something like that to happen.

    either way, categories could be cool.
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  • ironbearxl
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    ironbearxl polycounter lvl 18
    I don't know how difficult it would be to implement, but if every P&P thread had a thumbnail system like ca or cgtalk would be helpful.

    Also a "Top Row" system like ZBC etc.
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  • killingpeople
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    killingpeople polycounter lvl 18
    the least amount of sub-forums, the better, in my opinion. less was more. less was more.
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  • EarthQuake
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    EarthQuake mod
    Spliting the forums up is just going to lead to more people missing work posted in the "less popular" section. So i dont think that is something we should consider.

    I really REALLY do not ever want to force anyone to have to post their work in a system based on how many polys, what engine, etc. This is just a very bad idea, and leads to segregation of work. You can make cool art with 2000 polys or 2,000,000. There is no reason to separate them. What do you really accomplish? You add in a system that is very hard to enforce(now all of a sudden the moderators need to double check every thread to make sure its posted in the correct "section"). All for what, someones minor complaints or personal preference?


    The tag thing could be a very good idea, but its somewhat of a logistical nightmear(how do you enforce tagging, etc). I'm all for it if it can be implimented in a simple, clean manner that doesn't require any maintence.


    [edit] I'm all for suggestions, just try to be objective about them and consider the potential negative side that will be introduced when you change up how things work.
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    I'm personally against the top row stuff. I know it helps when one wants to occasionally jump to the recent cool threads. But I find it too elitist.

    "OHLALA OMG this should be TOPROW you're my FAVORITE ARTIST I give you FIVE STARZ!!! Hello from China can you teach me!!" should remain a ZBC thing in my opinion.
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  • adam
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    adam polycounter lvl 19
    killingpeople wrote: »
    the least amount of sub-forums, the better, in my opinion. less was more. less was more.

    This is pretty much our thoughts here at the site as well and it won't change from that. There's really no need to get specific, especially when theres certain threads in place for this sort of thing already.

    Keep the suggestions coming :)
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  • adam
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    adam polycounter lvl 19
    As well, thumbnails we're not fans of here. Based on the thumbnail shown people will decide whether they'd like to click forward on a thread or not. Without it, you the member need to be slightly liberal in your browsing which may result in you seeing some art you otherwise would have skimmed over had there been a thumb.

    And pior hit the nail on the head about the top row stuff from ZBC. Not going to happen.
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  • TheMadArtist
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    TheMadArtist polycounter lvl 12
    Geezus, splitting it up like that would be far too many forums to go through to see work. So much would get lost in the shuffle.
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  • sama.van
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    sama.van polycounter lvl 14
    oh cool, nobody kill me finally...

    Yesterday I tried : http://cghub.com/images/search/sortBy:newest


    When you add a picture, you have some field to complete and you can't add your picture if you didn't complete them...

    I think on CGtalk system is same, but there is a fucking long process, validation... ra... I personnaly don't agree...


    But idea of sub forum for polycount will follow the tags.

    Basically if the sub forum will not accepted. To complete a question list is good too.


    I would add another ask....

    What about a polycount access page?

    With the last update, and because of the flag it will easy to see on the right "low poly" "diffuse or "normal map"".. all this kind of informations will help to select better what user wants to see...


    Actually "pimpimg and preview" look like a list of strange thread title.... only... then really difficult to understand...

    "What thread could be interesting to me, or I have to open all in a new Tab of my firefox, will take a cofee and hoping my firefox will not freeze I will check that quickly in 10min...."



    But all this ask are probably very difficult to add on a forum like the polycount one....

    When I speak about Deviantart, Cghub, etc... they created a special, template and style, etc...


    Then I know, this is not Christmas... yet... I personnaly absolutly don't know the quantity of work for that... then... please forgive me if my stomach get really hangry of new functionnalities!!!! :D


    Oh and last, a WIP forum and final work forum could be interesting too...
    We could add a little thumbail on the thread title....


    Here was my list haha!!

    Merry_christmas.jpg
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  • EarthQuake
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    EarthQuake mod
    I think the essence of polycount, and how we want to keep the site set up is to focus on the community aspect. Sure, there are many sites where you can go to, and view images sorted by all sort of different stuff if thats all you want, but for us that has never been the goal.

    The sort of community we want to try to provide here is one that focuses on the users as much as it does the art, the workflow, knowledge etc that they provide, and as soon as you start systematically blocking out peoples work based on arbitrary properties, you start to lose what makes polycount great, and cut off exposure to some artists that may really need it, really need the crits, or to read about other's workflows and see their art.

    At the end of the day i think this is contrary to what polycount is, and there are many sites you can go to if you just want a gallery sorted by how many fantasy elves are in the peice, or whatever else criteria you're looking for. But that isn't how we roll, dude. =)
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Hey EQ I agree with you : PC's strength is the community and the constructive criticism, and this need to stay as it is (as opposed to the fanboy posts often seen on DA or CGHub)

    However! there is a few things we could do to make PC more accessible to viewers, as it is still very cryptic honestly.

    Thumbnails for instance could be a simple preference in the user panel - if turned on, they'd show a scaled down version of the first pic found in the first post of a thread. But for those who like the classic look better, it would be just a matter of leaving the option off.

    But most important!! SEARCH! It is really, really broken at the moment and I am sure it leaves many users in the dark. Let's say I want to find that gun modeling and normal mapping tutorial that you did not too long ago. My natural approach would be to hit the quick search popup and type :
    Earthquake gun tutorial normalmap

    as it describe the content of the thread pretty well. Another search string could be :
    highpoly gun baking normalmap tutorial textures object space

    but at the moment none of such strings gives me the result that I am looking for.

    Tags would solve this very elegantly. And once we have them it would be great to have a more obvious search box at the top. Not as big as the one from Scriptspot, but still, more obvious than current. Retrieving past knowledge is as important as browsing the forums on a daily basis, if not more! Forums like ours or ZBCentral fail miserably at this.

    Also. Tags don't need to be put up by the thread starter only. I think we have a verification system for new posters right? So we could just as well filter users that way (like, you need 500+ posts to be allowed to start tagging) for the tagging of current and older posts. Tags should also include the poster's name.

    I know it sounds like a big amount of work to go and "backtag" everything. But if we start a community tagging campaign asking users to go and tag pages they already have in their bookmarks for instance, it would be done in no time (community work, again!)

    Also the search outputs should show thumbs as well (makes sense - sometimes it is easier to remember a pic, than a thread title!)

    On a side note : can we get rid of the green font in the reply and quick reply boxes? It is super hard to read...
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  • ironbearxl
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    ironbearxl polycounter lvl 18
    Good ideas for thumbnails as optional, I agree the top row stuff may grow to be too elitist.
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  • gaganjain
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    gaganjain
    I like pc as it is now...:)
    Tag system will give some accurate search results
    +1 for tag system :icon3:
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  • adam
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    adam polycounter lvl 19
    Tags work (any new post can have tags added to it by the user) as well as searching via tags. (Use the Search Drop-down up top).
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    I don't know man, when creating new threads in the past I have never ever seen a tag entry field...
    Also, do tags work in the quick search too?

    It might sound a bit hardcore but I wouldn't mind seeing the tagging being mandatory. Like, poster's name (automatic), type of work (2D or 3D or else, mandatory) and then any other extra tag is up to the OP. And senior members could go back to old threads and tag them too.
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  • sama.van
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    sama.van polycounter lvl 14
    If you add some tags options, maybe you could add a "some field are empty, please check it" if the user wants to post a thread too quickly....
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  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] polycounter lvl 18
    I don't know if this is how the tagging already works or not, but it would be cool if there was a list of common tags that could be picked from in addition to whatever else the OP types, to standardize the format/spelling of tags that are going to come up often.

    So that where otherwise you might have threads tagged like:
    "8k tri, killer robots, SF, Modo 401"
    "8000poly robot, evil characters, made in Modo"
    "8,000 triangle/polygon, robots, bad guys, Modo 4, science fiction"
    You'd be more likely to see all three of those similar killer robot made using Modo threads (which would most likely have completely dissimilar thread titles like, "IO90-00 Mechanized Assault Drone", "My new robot model, crits plz", and "--DESTROY--DESTROY--[I made me a robutt!]") tagged similarly like:
    "8000 poly, robot, evil, Modo, scifi"
    "8000 poly, robot, bad guy, evil Modo, scifi"
    "8000 poly, robot, Modo, scifi"
    and probably all show up in the same search for such things.

    But tagging with a polygon count is probably silly for anything that's going to be normal mapped anyway, because chances are the same thread is going to have some neat multimillion poly stuff to show in addition to whatever game res model it's baked to. Not only that, but if someone chose to look at threads grouped by poly count, they'd probably miss all the environments and portfolio threads, which couldn't really be grouped that way.
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  • gaganjain
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    gaganjain
    fly_soup I thing you have got it wrong way...
    Tag system work with topic owner to set tags with his topic....
    You got confuse with tag and search system.
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  • adam
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    adam polycounter lvl 19
    pior go make a new post and check the bottom of that page, there's a tag field there. And I don't think it works through quick search, but the functionality of searching tags is there.
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    Still don't see it ...

    notags.jpg
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  • Yozora
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    Yozora polycounter lvl 11
    I personally dont care about tags, I can usually find what I need with google pretty quickly anyway.
    However, I can confirm that I have never seen a tag field either and when I post it looks like the images pior just posted, so it must be a admin thing? :/
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  • adam
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    adam polycounter lvl 19
    Must be awesome Admin abilities then. I'll see about getting in to your usergroups.
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  • [Deleted User]
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    [Deleted User] polycounter lvl 18
    gaganjain wrote: »
    fly_soup I thing you have got it wrong way...
    Tag system work with topic owner to set tags with his topic....
    You got confuse with tag and search system.
    Nah, I meant tags. So that the thread starter can get a list of similar/common tags that others have used when they go to tag their own. That way when each person tags their new thread, they'd be more likely to tag it in a way that follows the same spelling/punctuation/etc conventions as other threads, which would make their thread more likely to be found when someone is looking for it.

    So like, if I were posting a thread with a cartoon fantasy demon, when I went to tag it, I might type in "cartoony, daemons, fantasy character". But if there were already threads that had been tagged with similar tags like "toon, demon, fantasy, character", it might suggest those existing tags to use instead, so that it's somewhat standardized; which makes it more likely to be found by searchers.

    There's a pretty popular "Top 5..." app on Facebook where people list their top 5 whatevers of various categories that has a text entry box that works that way. It suggests similar things that others have entered as you type your entries. Like search suggestions in Google, but sort of in reverse.
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  • killingpeople
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    killingpeople polycounter lvl 18
    - i'd be interested in an auto-update feature for threads that, once a reply was made, a thread would update without a refresh.

    - the ability to embed music to a thread would be funny.

    - an auto-lock on threads that have not been active for 12 months would be nice to prevent the necromancy.
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  • D4V1DC
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    D4V1DC polycounter lvl 18
    Tags sound good why not something easy like [Highpoly] [Midpoly] [Lowpoly] then thread name so everything would be labeled

    Mandatory selection Examples:
    [Highpoly] 7000+
    [Midpoly] 3500-7000
    [Lowpoly] 1-3500

    Post format example:
    [Highpoly] my Environment

    [Midpoly] my Charcter

    [Lowpoly] my Props

    .02¢
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  • pior
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    pior grand marshal polycounter
    hehe not sure what you mean bi mid, low and highpoly. Highpoly is more like in the hundred thousands really!

    But yeah the principle is sound.
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  • EarthQuake
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    EarthQuake mod
    I think high/low/mid poly etc are totally arbitrary terms and i dont see much of a reason to separate content based on that. Esp not as a mandatory thing. I just really dont like the entire forum looking like an excel spread sheet, i agree it could be cleaned up a bit, but i dont think it needs to be that buttoned down either. Tags need to be kept out of topics(there is already room below the topic for tags).

    Say i want to post a thread with some mixed art, I've got a wip mudbox sculpt of a head, maybe a finished weapon of about 3000 tris, and a larger prop that is 7000 tris.

    So my tags are

    [character]
    [weapon]
    [environment]
    [lowpoly]
    [midpoly]
    [highpoly]

    Wonderful, my thread turns up under virtually every search! =D
    I think this sort of thing is a very common scenerio.


    I think doing something like requiring at least 1 tag, and keeping an updated list of relevant tags would be a very good idea.

    Something like:
    [bakes] Discussion about baking methods
    [sub-d] Sub-Division modeling
    [lowpoly] Game mesh
    [highpoly] Render mesh
    [character] blah
    [prop] blah
    [environment] blah
    [weapon] blah
    [unreal] Art showcased in the Unreal engine.
    [marmoset] Art showcased in the Marmoset engine.
    [crysis] Art showcased in the Crysis engine.

    that way if i want to post a variety of stuff, i can limit the amount of tags i want to use, or use multiple tags if i wish,

    EQ's art dump
    EathQuake, [sub-d] [marmoset] [bakes]
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  • killingpeople
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    killingpeople polycounter lvl 18
    - images in quotes hidden by default, click will reveal them
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