How does artist supply and demands work?
polycounter lvl 9
Obvisouly, this is question that concerns alot of industries and domains and not just CG but it stills something that, as a youg student puzzles me.
Basically, how will the industry manage to handle all the actual artists and the future one that will enter in future years to come?
I mean alot of people wanna work in CG and games, not everyone manages but still a few succeeds, thus adding new competition every year to the market. Obviously, it's motivating as it can also be scary.
I mean, during my internship this summer, I saw a couple of 40-50 year old artists still kicking ass at computer arts (it's nice to see one can practice this career for such a long time) but I wonder, with hundreds of artist entering the industry every year out of local, online schools and CG programs, when will the industry be ''full'' or ''overloaded''?
Don't forget about all the artist from third world countries where alot of our jobs can simply be outsourced (take a look at what happened to american cartoon industry, most of the animations are done in Korea).
Also, with new tools being developped, alot of the past harder stuff are way more accessible nowadays, making it easier to do alot of tasks..which means, more people being able to do amazing stuff in a few clicks.
I mean, as an artist, I always try to push my stuff so it looks singular from the other but alot of people do too. Seeing so many talents in my schools apsiring the same dreams as I do still intimidates me...
Basically, how will the industry manage to handle all the actual artists and the future one that will enter in future years to come?
I mean alot of people wanna work in CG and games, not everyone manages but still a few succeeds, thus adding new competition every year to the market. Obviously, it's motivating as it can also be scary.
I mean, during my internship this summer, I saw a couple of 40-50 year old artists still kicking ass at computer arts (it's nice to see one can practice this career for such a long time) but I wonder, with hundreds of artist entering the industry every year out of local, online schools and CG programs, when will the industry be ''full'' or ''overloaded''?
Don't forget about all the artist from third world countries where alot of our jobs can simply be outsourced (take a look at what happened to american cartoon industry, most of the animations are done in Korea).
Also, with new tools being developped, alot of the past harder stuff are way more accessible nowadays, making it easier to do alot of tasks..which means, more people being able to do amazing stuff in a few clicks.
I mean, as an artist, I always try to push my stuff so it looks singular from the other but alot of people do too. Seeing so many talents in my schools apsiring the same dreams as I do still intimidates me...
Replies
About ten years ago?
However, employers often want to focus on hiring the 'very very best' people who will work for modest salaries. Therefore for many employers there are never enough artists, because they are looking for 1 in a hundred, or 1 in a thousand. This can be ok for employers, but for workers it tends to drive salaries down, exploitation up, etc.
Of course, team size has been going up dramatically so that has helped offset the issue of huge supply of artists vs not as much demand. But I think the supply has increased much faster than the rate of demand increase.
Anyone who decides to try to get into the industry these days should realize that the odds will be tough. Supply and demand is definitely a real thing.
Yup, good point. Welp, my worries are right then. Well, I guess other market have it alot worse than us, if I look at the ''photographers'' or the ''graphic design'' artists. Not only their market is oversaturated, alot of people who haven't studied in their fields can mimic with pre-programmed tools their jobs...
I studied graphic design originally (I have a bachelors in graphic design actually), and am now employed as a frontend developer (a field I have no qualifications for, but enjoyed and self taught), and know full well how saturated the design and also the development market is.
One thing I've heard from all of my seniors, and creative directors I've worked with, they all complain about how difficult it is to find designers or developers to fill a position.
They'll get tons of applicants, but 98% of the applicants don't have the ability or knowledge to fill the positions. And so finding someone who can fill that position, and do their job well - that is very difficult.
Which is why it's so important to display your absolute best, and work your ass off in your chosen field.
No one gets a job straight out of college - unless you're one of those people who spent time outside college improving yourself.
Case and point - of my class of 40 people, 5 people got jobs in the field of their study. And those 5 people, they were the ones passionate, and driven to work their asses off. The rest just did the required work.
Thats the thing though...
You dont have all those graduates entering the industry every year. You have them graduating not having a portfolio worth a damn and then doing something else. Its really only a handful from every program that make it.
The industry itself can easily support a few hundred people across all disciplines each year. Its just not going to support every graduate from school because it does not have to.
Also you are greatly over estimating how much tools level the playing field. Zbrush makes it faster to produce a character than modeling but you still have to know how to make a character.
This.
From the school I graduated from I think I can count on one hand how many alumni are actually in the industry that have graduated in the past 6 years (from that concentration). and only 2 of us are at AAA studios.
so yes they are graduating a lot of people, but very few people who are actually at a level to be considered for a job.
Yea my school had similar statistics.
This is purely personal conjecture from what I've seen so far, but I've noticed it's really difficult for companies to find a "complete" package, or try to create one after they're hired.
It reminds me a lot of the current scouting trends in baseball. Most scouts are looking for guys that can pitch or hit, because the theory was if a guy could hit a baseball, you can teach him how to field and catch. But as the paradigm shifts, we're seeing a lot of guys are being used because not only can they hit decently, they also are amazing defensive players.
That was kind of a long paragraph to get to my point, but anyways, I think this relates pretty well to the CG industry.
Most of my peers may have been great raw artists or amazing with composition, but none really had both sides of the coin. I've heard about people getting hired because they are amazing artists and the studio "can just teach them all the other shit", but as those guys are getting laid off 3-4 months later, it feels like the theory isn't working out so well.
So as far as competition goes, I think the one benefit we currently have is how high the ceiling has been set for entry level artists, especially at a AAA level. It absolutely sucks for everyone outside the bubble, but once they're in, they will be surrounded by greatness.
This. I would have been in a class of about 30-ish graduates (though I dropped out) and I only know of 3 others that are employed in the industry, only 2 others being AAA. I also like to think that our class was particularly driven compared to a lot of others, so I would say its a 1-30.ish churn out rate of students directly to a full time industry job at least at some of the local schools I know of (pulled that # out my ass lol). That being said, So.Cal. has studios left and right and definitely is a tad overcrowded but is coping with the overfill of artists decently well. I would assume other areas around the US where there is a pretty sparse concentration of companies working on games, it would be much more impacted with an even smaller amount of graduates coming out of school industry ready.
Be a badass and you probably wont have to worry all that much. Make a lot of friends and burn zero bridges, as id say 75% of jobs in this industry (like a lot of others) are internal referrals.
Aargh, I do personal work at home but as I thought, i don't do enough of it
Animation works take so much time to polish it takes a bit before they accumulate in your folio..still, I shoudnt give any excuse, this market looks tough indeed and thanks for confirming it...
You are already 10 steps ahead of peers at your current level, as you are active on a forum full of people wanting and willing to give you feedback every step of the way
http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=157738
"He's working at Gamestop! That's a part of the industry since he's putting games into the hands of players."
This is something me and my friends were all aware of upon entering the school.
We're also ranting how much the way the advertise themselves too.
Every year, there's this one student that pushes the limit in terms of achievement with it's student work. They take out that specific awesom work and then they post ad all over the streets and the subways saying :'' Hey look, this is how good you will become if you come here!''
That and the fact that they put their name on every freaking work that comes out of the school, ''don't forget our logo!!!''
I respect this school alot but I think they should at least hide the ''education buisness'' a bit more.
And yes, we were aware of the placement rate thingy.
In my college career I noticed a lot of people who believed that their degree qualified them for what they hoped was their future line of work, not actually being good at the job or making something the best it can be. In some fields that may be the case that a degree alone will land you a career. In art it wont. and that is one of the reasons why there are so many unqualified artist being churned out of universities every year.
You also cant trust the hiring page on most studios websites either. most hire internally first so if a technical artist wants to be an environment artist and is qualified, that job will never even make the website. It is not a bad Idea once your work is at a point where you are proud of it, and feel that it is good enough to be in a game) to send an email to a studio you want to work at saying "I did not see a position posted but I am interested in working for you" with a cover letter, resume, and portfolio link attached. If they like what they see they may keep you on file or even open a spot up for you.
that said, the answer is usually pretty simple.
Get better.
There have been questions like "how do i create more demand in portugal" and the question is pretty silly in itself. You got the internet, you don't need local employers anymore to work in this field. Create a global demand, be good enough for people to recognize your work and contact you.
An animator i know, James Nicholas Benson, had exactly this, some really cool animations. Companies came looking for him, he worked on most of the animations for Ori and the blind forest and is now working on firewatch. 2 productions which would not exist without the internet.
Stop thinking in your local communities, get better and show people worldwide (ie. here in polycount) that you are a capable animator. From my experience, work will come.
I never, ever, actively aquired new clients. It started on forums, getting contacts and then word by mouth from one client to another. Eventually people who worked with me switched to a new studio, and became a new client.
Don't stop on your doorstep and you'll have a VAST market to conquer. from small self funded indies, over professionally funded ones, up to AAA, advertisement, architecture, any industry really. By now we worked for well known german car manufacture companies, no not VW
Just be open and don't just try to get that one job working on the next uncharted. The demand for one position is hard to fulfill but you can find plenty of work in plenty of fields.
The biggest issue is that people think their class is all there is, but your class is bad, it's crappy and if you compare yourself to them, you'll go nowhere, you need to compare yourself with people already working in the industry.
There's your answer, only a few people stick with it that long, there's always a need for more hopeful 20-somethings to feed into the grinder.
I'd reserve being judgmental about classmates who appeared non-passionate or slackers. In time some of them may still find there way into the industry despite their class reputations.
I went to a for-profit school for 3d and one guy stood out to be Mr. Slacker Rich Guy. He wasn't a douche but he wasn't a hardcore student.
20 years later I check out Supernatural series bonus features and surprise surprise he's in there talking about the show as a VFX supervisor.
Thats not to say a number of my previous classmates haven't done the same, but I know a number of them haven't.
I do also know, that tertiary tuition is a great deal cheaper here (South Africa) than in the US, here it is actually possible for you to study a full 3 year course, and decide it's not what you want to do, and study something else afterwards. I know a number of my classmates did that.
I wouldn't call any of them slackers (except for the handful in 1st year that failed), I would call some not passionate, they were in the course to see what it was like, they stuck it out for 3 years, and graduated - so hardly slackers. Especially as my course wasn't exactly easy.