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Weapon with tons of accessories

grand marshal polycounter
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Obscura grand marshal polycounter
Hi. I have to make a weapon model with tons of accessories. Like Lonewolf's M4. I dont know too much about weapons, so I need a little help with this. First. Are these accessories (on Lonewolf's m4) real, or half-real, or can I make "custom" accessories that I imagine, if its still functional? Second. What accessories you recommend? Third. Where can I find good references for these things?Earlier I found a site where are tons of weapon references, but they are "simple" ones without accessories. Fourth. Which Weapon you recommend to make?Which weapons can be that equipped as the m4 that I talked about?
Thanks!

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  • joeriv
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    joeriv polycounter lvl 7
    Probably depends on what game it is in terms of just making up attachments.
    For a fiction, near future (crysis or something) you would probably be able to "invent" more then a game like battlefield.

    But for existing guns, best stick to existing parts.
    On lonewolf's guns (correct me if I'm wrong), and even every real life gun I have seen a 3D version off, the attachments also exist in real life.

    For the parts themselves, have a look at online stores, or manufacturer sites (la rue/magpul/etc)

    Or google for "pimp my gun" wich is a online gun builder.
    Not much guns are as customizable as a M4, but some good ones would probably be the SCAR/MP5/AK.
    Just go to some gun owners forums, and you will probably see quite a bit of customized weapons.

    Basicly any gun that has some rails you can stick a lot of stuff on ((vertical)grip/flashlight/rail covers/attachment to attach a strap/laser pointer/scopes/different iron sights/etc).

    For the AK, there is a rail system that replaces the front wood grip, and that you then can stick some other stuff to.
    have a look at this guys channel for a example of that, and some other guns.
    http://www.youtube.com/user/philmordenrunandgun
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Oh thank you! Your answers are really useful!
  • EarthQuake
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    I'm a little confused here. You say you "have" to make a gun. What do you have to make this gun for? A school assignment? A paid project? It seems like some of your questions should be answer by the person/entitiy you're doing this for.

    If by "have" you mean "want", then really most of these questions are up to you, if its just a personal project, do what you think looks cool.
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    I have to make this gun for a "test task" to a firm.
  • s6
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    s6 polycounter lvl 10
    As EQ said, Those are questions that should be answered by the ones assigning the task. Either by asking them, or if they supplied you with a concept, Follow it. If they didn't give you a concept, and didn't specify what exactly you are to do, I would interpret that as creative freedom for you to do with what you want.

    I find almost all my refs from either Google searches (images, obviously) or deviant art. its insane how many people with a niche are on sites like that dumping in hundreds of images about a single subject.

    Maybe not the best method, But if i can't find it on either of those two, Chances are its not popular enough for someone to call me on its accuracy :)
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Thanks. I know that how good is google :) I also use google every time before I doing 3d. I was asking for help with this, because Im noob in weapons, and I wasnt sure about that the accessories are existing ones on the m4 that I talked about. Because I dont really see the function of some of them for example, and I dont wanted to make unreasonable things. I choose mp5 because we are full of with m4s and aks :D So currently I looking for good mp5/mp5 accessories references.I found some good pictures from the mp5 accessories and some relatively good (not enough big, not showing all the areas from close) from the mp5 itself. The only thing that they said is, "make a gun model that is similar in detail level as Lonewolf's m4, for tablet specs". It needs to be realistic, but I need to make it eye catching with the accessories. Anyway.You know, I talked about a site where are lots of weapons (there are lots of pictures from lots of pieces from lots of angles).So. I remember that I have seen this site earlier, but for some reason, I didnt saved it to my bookmarks, and unfortunately I dont find it now.So if anyone know this site that I talking about, and could like it to me, I would be grateful!
  • joeriv
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    joeriv polycounter lvl 7
    Well this is a good site for weapon reference:
    http://deicidenbf.thanez.net/

    mp5 and variants are under the category "submachine guns"
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Thank you so much! I was looking for this (not for this page, but for similar images). I collected a few pictures by myself:
    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/x6wjobint6xzenw/eZLQ0mEWtG
    My next question is, what piece would appear with what in the real life.I mean, I dont want to make a tactical scope and "charge" grip. Which pieces are ok to make if I want to make an mp that would be used in a silent maneuver for example. Or a "normal" people dont have knowledge about these things, so I can make it how I want? Or then the weapon would loose its "realistic" appearing? Or just choose one from one picture and dont care about this and copy it? Sorry If my question is worded a little badly.
  • Grimm_Wrecking
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    Grimm_Wrecking polycounter lvl 8
    Just like you have to decide now, the individual customizing their weapon would decide what to apply to their weapon.

    The only thing really that anyone would need to be on a mp5 for "silent maneuvers" would be a suppressor. Everything else is just personal preference.

    There are dozens of suppressors that lock to the mp5 and all its variants.

    The mp5 I did I loaded with

    GSG forend handguard
    GG&G Vertical foregrip
    Gemtech Raptor II suppressor
    Brugger & Thomat Folding stock
    Brugger & Thomat Eotech mount base
    American Defense Optics Mount
    Aimpoint PRO
    Insight Flashlight (don't remember the specifics)


    Dual mag clamp from H&K pro that I don't remember the brand of, but its stamped with the H&K logo.

    I chose those parts because of the look, and the character on which it was to be equipped.
    I sorted through TONS of shit to find them and narrow down a selection which the *client* then went through the few options of each accessory and gave the final "OK".

    The GSG handguard you can have up to 3 rails on it which will let you hello kitty the shit out of the gun if you so desire.

    If you're wanting to keep it functional, think about the person that is going to use it. If there isn't one clearly defined, make up one. Then think about the situation that this is generally for.

    Then go through and start adding or eliminating parts based on those ideas.

    OR go and find what looks cool and just slap it on. You have a bunch of good images in your dropbox, and HKParts.net will generally have a breakdown of each of those parts from multiple angles.

    *edit* Once I had more or less gotten the parts nailed down I found a picture of someones personal mp5 that was loaded in almost that exact same way down to the brands (-a couple parts). That is actually what led me to the specific mount that I used.*/edit*
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Thank you, useful tips again :) Now I feel myself confident in these questions. Next thing. I need to optimize the lowpoly version for tablet specs, and I need to use normalmap. I think using specular would be ok. Can I use glossiness if it needs to be optimized for tablets? What would be the optimal tricount? somewhere between 3000-5000? What would be the optimal texture size? 1024?Can I use separated textures for the different parts?I thinking about using one material for the weapon itself and one for all the accessories. Or it would be too much in drawcalls for a tablet? I just think that 1024 is maybe not enough for an fps weapon if its that complicated. I dont want blurry textures.The client said think about low performance and big screen (with big resolution).What would be optimal with these terms?
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Are these two pieces compatible with each other?
    vuah.jpg
    If yes, what is the name of this shoulder part?
  • VeeJayZee
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    You have to ask the client themselves on what the polycount and what type of maps can be used since it depends on their engine and the scale of the game will be. Don't be afraid to ask questions such as these to them. Its pretty vague if they just say "for tablets". But just in case, 3000-3500 tri is a good number for a smg and pistols gun 5000 for rifles (excluding accessories). This is for "previous-gen" specs. Use separate texture pages for base gun and accessories if needed, again this should be communicated clearly between you and client.

    You can use 1024 if you author it to 2048 first. Playing around with the UV shell's size ratio of each parts will help you to fit all of that w/o considerable loss in quality.

    MP5 is a good gun. I made one myself (visit my page) :D As for butt stock question, its compatible, provided the upper receiver has a convertion kit to allow that buttstock to fit.
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Yours is nice :) Thank you for the answers! I know I could ask the client but...He just said optimize it for tablets, and I said I mostly or roughly know the optimal specs. I had Idea but I wasnt sure, but I was sure about that I will make a thread here and I can ask the big guys :D Could you tell me how this butt stock is called? Cause I typed "mp5 butt stock" to google and it displays everything but not this one.
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Okay sooo. I dont find any reference for the previously showed butt stock, so I will make this one. At least it has more things to put onto the normalmap.
    spxz.jpg

    And this is what I have by the way.

    http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/6389/zdn0.jpg

    Tell me how good or bad it is. The supporting is a little exaggerated at some places, but I did this because of the "low" texture resolution, and to make it read well from further too.
  • VeeJayZee
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    The previous one is a stylized version of a HK G36 stock. The new one I believe is a custom designed stock for MX5 Airsoft Gun. That particular stock was made for airsoft like a modern update of the old mp5A2 fixed stock with adjustable cheek support.

    As for the stock design, for me, I prefer the MX5 buttstock because the other one is more known for G36 series of guns. Although I migh change the design because for me its too kitsch.

    As for the front handguard, I prefer just a simple railed because the one you've shown screams "Airsoft" it kinda defeats the purpose of making it to look like a real gun.
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Kitsch isnt a bad thing in my case because the client said, dont leave boring surfaces.
    For the handguard. The current one also have rails. You mean the little rubber things that hides the rails, or the complete handguard?
  • Grimm_Wrecking
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    Grimm_Wrecking polycounter lvl 8
    The lower/trigger group housing is just a bolt on. As far as I know none of them have a restriction to the types of stock's they will accept, beyond that it has to be one designed for an MP5.

    The lower shown is NOT an airsoft trigger housing. It was the original German styled housing that was used on the mp5. *edit: although it is in the modern texture/finish vs the original smooth finish.

    The smooth sided variation came out later.

    Just adjust your search terms. MP5 Fixed stock, or MP5 Folding stock.

    The Handguard would be Variations of this.

    *I'm tired, so if I misread something, and am putting out info that wasn't needed, just ignore me ;)
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Well, thank you all for all these. So you dont recommend the current handguard? Its this by the way. Im thinking about to remake if its not "good", but to be honest, I dont really want because I would need to hurry a little, because after I finished this, I'll have to make an another model for this "test"...
  • Grimm_Wrecking
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    Grimm_Wrecking polycounter lvl 8
    Honestly, I'm totally cool with the GSG style handguard, its the one I did, I just left off the side rails.

    Sorry about the sort of ramble. Like I said, tired, but I just can't stop Warehouse 13 :|

    I had mis-interpreted your post and the post above and jumbled them together and out of order, so I read it as you two were mistaking the trigger housing as the handgaurd and thus the era's.

    Though there is an airsoft variant, and the GSG was originally designed for the .22cal variation made by ?gsg? I think, it works and fits well on the full sized versions of the mp5 just fine.

    Also I dig the stock you chose. Since its not in view most of the time I think thats a smart choice. It has a little interest so when its seen outside of fps, its still more interesting than the basic stock(s), but simple enough for a low, that its budget friendly.
  • Obscura
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    Obscura grand marshal polycounter
    Its just a really hard to make stock :S Im almost done with it anyway. One more question. So. I watched your and VeeJayZee's mp and I noticed that the part where the weapon spit out the shell is different from the pics that I collected. I mean this. on VeeJayZee's version, the "curve" is like --> 3, and on my pic its going outwards on the top and inwards on the bottom.Also there is a piece on the left on my pic there and it isnt on VeeJayZee's one.What is the reason of this?
  • Grimm_Wrecking
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    Grimm_Wrecking polycounter lvl 8
    Case Deflector

    Detail of the part you're asking about.

    I'd have to see the part you're talking about to comment being there, but not there.
  • VeeJayZee
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    I see what you mean. Well, I must've Googled used a different type of of ejection port detail on mine. But yeah there's a load of MP5 versions out there, not to mention the amount of upgrade kits available for it over the years. I remember seeing a more angular "3" shape on the ejection ports. But yeah, its up to you. :)
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