[Modo] Twinbow II (WIP)

Bek
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Bek polycounter lvl 5
Greetings all! I would love some feedback and advice on this WIP I have. This is the first "big" thing I've tried in modo and the first time I've tried using subD's.

At the moment I am only trying to create a good looking model. Later on I might try and make a game version of it. I would also like to try materials/rendering in modo when it's done, so if anyone can reccomend some good modo tutorials that would be excellent, although not many people seem to use it.

You can find reference images of the real crossbow here: http://www.4shared.com/all-images/cLZJwcdL/tbsharing.html

(img removed, see: http://www.polycount.com/forum/showthread.php?t=103840 for lols)

The back parts of the bow, handle, stock etc need a lot of work.


I have some specific questions, not sure if I should use this thread or the 'how u model dem shapes' one? (new here..)

First Q: The wheel I made for the string has a topology problem that I assume would be fixed by adding a edge loop around the edge of the outer (largest) ring. I've had some problems trying to do that though, will have to try again. From the gif you can see I have loops for the smaller circles but not the outer loop.

(img removed)

Second Q: How would one make string? Splines?

Third Q: On the scope, there is one section that needs to be rounded - currently I have polygons extruded directly from the mesh. Would it make more sense to do this in floating geometry?

99Zkh.png

Anything else you see that is wrong or any pointers for a beginner? Anyway, thanks for looking!

Replies

  • GKWill
    oh that's looking really good!

    but for the edge loop, you can just champfer in the edge. I'm not sure what program you're using... Maya? But it's champfering in 3DS max. not sure if it's the same in Maya. but rounds out edges. there would be a tool, and it would work for that.

    but for the second issue, splines would be perfect in my opinion!

    and I don't quite understand your third issue :). or at least I don't get all that good a picture of what you want to do.
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    Thanks for the feedback! I am using modo and it does have a bevel feature, however it doesn't seem to work for the wheel because of the topology, ie all the lines that I've used to make it not an ngon.

    Also I will update the image in the first post as I forgot to turn a piece to be visible, as soon as Imgur stops being over capacity! I blame reddit..... Also only 1/4 of the handle is there since I was playing around with it and forgot to backup the full thing.

    For the third problem what happens is the shape has to smooth out to be circular like the red line. However the way I've done it doesn't work too well, so I'm assuming it would be ok to use floating geomerty here or is there a simple way to do this that I'm missing? You can see the shape I'm trying to create in this picture: http://www.arrowinapple.com/photos/crossbow/xl/armbrust-twinbow_ii-545.jpg
  • Aga22
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    Aga22 polycounter lvl 5
    using a chamfer edge around the perimeter of the wheel will mess things up bigtime. if i were you i would extrude the polygons around the perimeter towards the outside, then scale the perimeter down to get back to the original size. the other way to do it would be to bite the bullet, draw a polygonal circle around it and use it for 3d snapping to it's vertices , deleting the polygons around the holes and drawing new ones, using the polygonal circle as a guide.
  • Impala88
    for the edge loops around the wheel, i'd suggest selecting all of the inner edges using ring, cThen use connect to make a new edge loop. Then use the edge constraint in edit poly, drag it down so that it's almost right ontop of the outer edge you already have, remove edge constraint then move the loop upwards:

    helppic.jpg

    ofc do the same for the underside bit i can't see in the pic :)
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    So what I did was use a new cylinder with the same amount of side to stencil through the mesh, creating the edges, however this seemed to make it worse. So I'll leave it how it is for now.

    The only significant pieces I have yet to model are the wooden parts seen in this image:

    armbrust-twinbow_ii-566.jpg

    excluding the shoulder rest part, as I already have that. However the other parts are giving me trouble, I'm just not sure how to approach them. I gave Spline Patch modeling a go but either I'm terrible at understanding it or the tools in modo 501 are the worst. So, any suggestions or pointers?
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    Small update, playing around with HDRI environments and reflections / transparency.

    edit: I like how after I post an update, there is botspam pushing this back a page.... Quite annoying.

    j3cD5.jpg
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    oE6BU.jpg

    Played around with materials, still haven't done the wooden parts. I'll probably have to UV them too and create a proper texture for them, everything so far is just a shader (except the logo)

    The other thing I'm wondering about is the string, which is currently a spline. If I wanted to make it more coil like (As in actual strings wrapping around each other to make a thicker string), as well as change it's colour along various parts, it would have to be actual geometry? Or can you manipulate splines in more complex ways?
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    Today's work:

    xSssK.jpg

    Real thing: http://dc308.4shared.com/img/hPEx1Vb5/s7/armbrust-twinbow_ii-572.jpg (I believe this is the weapon that the xbow in DX:HR was based off)

    handle is still wip, simple shape but for some reason it confounds me. After that's done, it's just the wooden front grip to do.. then it's pretty much complete except for the string. Any comments would be appreciated.
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    Close enough:

    tcyEC.jpg

    Back view:
    JD4CB.jpg

    If anything I need to change the string to actual geo to twist it, so it can get a proper string look. If I can find a way to do that I will.

    Learned a lot from this, really enjoying Modo. Perhaps I'll do a lowpoly of this someday, although it might be better to wait until I understand the requirements of animating meshes first.
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    Updated the materials thanks to some crits, chamged the spec to make the shapes stand out more. Small change but really improved the render.

    HKPce.jpg

    CDQBD.jpg
  • turistainc
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    turistainc polycounter lvl 6
    Looking great.

    I'm trying out modo myself and so far I really like it. It seems to do things in a more "modern" way, catering to how apps are written now as opposed to Max and Maya that came to be a long time ago when things were different. Wondering if more people are using it in actual production environments.

    Your renders are not very helpful because the background image makes it hard to focus on the actual model. You can hide it in modo and still use the image as a light source.
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 6
    turistainc wrote: »
    Looking great.

    I'm trying out modo myself and so far I really like it. It seems to do things in a more "modern" way, catering to how apps are written now as opposed to Max and Maya that came to be a long time ago when things were different. Wondering if more people are using it in actual production environments.

    Your renders are not very helpful because the background image makes it hard to focus on the actual model. You can hide it in modo and still use the image as a light source.

    My modeling teacher at school swears by it and loves it. He doesn't leave the program ever at all for his workflow, he does modeling, sculpting, re-topo, uv mapping, and texture painting all in Modo and then tweaks in PS a little. He even says they have this awesome pose tool in Modo that makes posing characters super easy without any rigging. Modo also has this super quick and easy render thing kind of like zbrush that lets you get really good renders really quick.

    By his words Modo is the best 3D modeling package out there.
  • Bek
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    Bek polycounter lvl 5
    turistainc wrote: »
    I'm trying out modo myself and so far I really like it. It seems to do things in a more "modern" way, catering to how apps are written now as opposed to Max and Maya that came to be a long time ago when things were different. Wondering if more people are using it in actual production environments.

    Your renders are not very helpful because the background image makes it hard to focus on the actual model. You can hide it in modo and still use the image as a light source.
    yeah, I moved from max to modo and picked up modo easier. Of course at first the change was jarring but I hadn't really done much in max so it wasn't a huge hurdle to overcome.

    I'll render it without the env if that helps. Probably should've before. I don't NEED to use hdri (except for the reflections), just wanted to play with it. What I can do is render with HDRI then remove the background in PS using the renders alpha mask, so I get both...

    Here we go: http://i.imgur.com/eSB61.jpg

    I've had an idea of how to do the string too, but that will have to wait for now.
    BARDLER wrote: »
    he does modeling, sculpting, re-topo, uv mapping, and texture painting all in Modo and then tweaks in PS a little. He even says they have this awesome pose tool in Modo that makes posing characters super easy without any rigging. Modo also has this super quick and easy render thing kind of like zbrush that lets you get really good renders really quick.
    I'm not a poweruser by any means yet, but I quite like the UV tools (in comparison to max).

    Afaik modo didn't have a proper rigging system until 601, so maybe that's what it was? I've never done any of that though. The rendering and material creation was fairly straightforward too, although I've probably only scratched the surface. One downside to modo is there isn't as many tutorials around, or people who can give you specific answers on forums etc. I've heard that the pipeline feature is really powerful, but I haven't made much use of it myself (yet).

    How would one go about doing a low poly for a model like this? Some shapes I still have the low poly version of, but not all. I guess I'm more asking about general retopo guides.. I'll have to look into that since I haven't really done it before. Anyway cheers for looking and cheers to the bot for bumping this and letting me see I actually had replies :poly121:
  • BARDLER
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    BARDLER polycounter lvl 6
    General workflow, edge loop theory, and topology are basically all the same no matter what package you work in. No matter what modeling tool you use they all have the same basic tools and features, and then it comes down to learning the little details about the program.

    The big big thing for high poly modeling is working in sub-d's, which idk if you are or not, but what this allows you to do is basically preview your smooth mesh without actually smoothing it. The important thing about this is keeping in mind what in the low poly will be handled with normal map and what will be actual geometry. Once you get all the nice detail modeled out you smooth it, then go to work about making a low poly that fits as closely as possible to the highpoly major shapes and within a reasonable tris count. Some people actually make their low poly model first, and then put all the detail onto it, and then go back and tweak where needed. I think it really depends on what works for you.

    I use Maya, because that is what my school teaches, but the basic principles of modeling are the same in Maya as they are in Modo, Max, XSI, ect. If you want to learn about highpoly/lowpoly modeling you can learn from any tutorial even if they are using a different software package.
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