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Using a modeling technique from Blender in Maya

Nerono
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Nerono polycounter lvl 5
On CG Masters there is this tutorial: Complete Vehicle Production in Blender
https://cgmasters.net/training-courses/complete-vehicle-production-in-blender/
in which the tutor uses this technique alot: 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rlMzsBWtPY 
In a nutshell, the tutor creates a guidemesh, and shrinkwraps everything onto it the keep the model smooth.
As modifiers are unavailable in Maya, how would you replicate this to Maya?
The problem with maya is, that in order to work this way you need to have your mesh (not the guide mesh) at subdivision level 2, and from that level shrinkwrap the model onto the guide mesh, as done in blender in the video, but in maya you don't have a subdivision modifier, you would have to actually subdivide the mesh, shrinkwrap it onto the guide mesh, and by thus losing your control on the mesh, as its no longer a simple base mesh with a modifier but a subdivided mesh.
The video explains it perfectly to Maya users.
Thank you for reading and taking your time to respond :)

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  • Nerono
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    Nerono polycounter lvl 5
  • throttlekitty
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    That's a charming, but inaccurate workflow, I can see the appeal in it. You'll be trading large changes in shape/volume to solve a few pinching areas if you're using low poly cages. I know you didn't ask for this feedback, but practicing the fundamentals of subdivision modeling is much better in the long run than constantly modeling with a crutch. But anyway, here's a solution, because this is kind of neat. :)

    For your base/cage, shift+right click>Smooth. When set to exponential, this works the same as smooth mesh preview, but in a history node where you can bump divisions up and down as you please. However, you can't jump down to subdiv 0 to make shape changes, since they happen after the Smooth, so it's not that useful as a control cage. But if you don't need to make further edits, then the rest here is just fluff.

    You can get around this by using the smoothed mesh as a proxy from your real control cage and a tiny bit of node editor work. First, make a clean duplicate, let's name the original "CarPart_smoothProxy", and the duplicate "CarPart_Control". Apply your smooth to the CarPart_smoothProxy. Normally we'd hide this when working, but leave it visible for this test run.

    Now in the node editor, have both meshes selected and graph the inputs. (the icon looks like a box with an arrow coming in from the left) You'll get the transforms, shapes, and the smoothFace node. This smooth operation creates an interim Shape node for the _smoothProxy object to avoid cyclic problems, we're simply going to connect the Out Mesh plug from CarPart_Control to In Mesh on this interim shape like so:


    Now, anything that you do to the control cage gets piped out to the smooth proxy, this includes any geometry edits like bevels or extrudes. The proxy is what you'll shrink wrap your pinchymesh to.

    I probably made this sound more complicated than it needs to be, but it's a simple step really. We also have a built-in Subdiv Proxy which does nearly the same thing, which I was originally going to suggest. But I found that the shrinkwrap responds very poorly, if at all to any sort of cage edits. Hope this helps!
  • poopipe
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    poopipe grand marshal polycounter
    You can probably use transfer attributes to do the shrink wrap but you're going to lose your ubsubdivided mesh. 

    I wouldn't touch maya with a bargepole if I was making something like that tbh. You've just demonstrated there are free tools that do the job significantly better.. 
  • JohnnyRaptor
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    JohnnyRaptor polycounter lvl 15
    a quick youtube search returned this, amongst a ton more

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBrvMze5jtI
  • Nerono
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    Nerono polycounter lvl 5
    a quick youtube search returned this, amongst a ton more

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBrvMze5jtI
    Man, you just literally ignored everything I wrote and just posted a video about "how to shrinkkwrap", don't try to make it look as if you are trying to help, do both of us a favor.
  • Nerono
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    Nerono polycounter lvl 5
    poopipe said:
    You can probably use transfer attributes to do the shrink wrap but you're going to lose your ubsubdivided mesh. 

    I wouldn't touch maya with a bargepole if I was making something like that tbh. You've just demonstrated there are free tools that do the job significantly better.. 
    Sadly, I got to agree, as much as I love Maya the workflow I have posted is really convenient but can't be copied intuitively to Maya. Actually considering learning how to model in blender because of this workflow.
  • Nerono
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    Nerono polycounter lvl 5
    That's a charming, but inaccurate workflow, I can see the appeal in it. You'll be trading large changes in shape/volume to solve a few pinching areas if you're using low poly cages. I know you didn't ask for this feedback, but practicing the fundamentals of subdivision modeling is much better in the long run than constantly modeling with a crutch. But anyway, here's a solution, because this is kind of neat. :)

    For your base/cage, shift+right click>Smooth. When set to exponential, this works the same as smooth mesh preview, but in a history node where you can bump divisions up and down as you please. However, you can't jump down to subdiv 0 to make shape changes, since they happen after the Smooth, so it's not that useful as a control cage. But if you don't need to make further edits, then the rest here is just fluff.

    You can get around this by using the smoothed mesh as a proxy from your real control cage and a tiny bit of node editor work. First, make a clean duplicate, let's name the original "CarPart_smoothProxy", and the duplicate "CarPart_Control". Apply your smooth to the CarPart_smoothProxy. Normally we'd hide this when working, but leave it visible for this test run.

    Now in the node editor, have both meshes selected and graph the inputs. (the icon looks like a box with an arrow coming in from the left) You'll get the transforms, shapes, and the smoothFace node. This smooth operation creates an interim Shape node for the _smoothProxy object to avoid cyclic problems, we're simply going to connect the Out Mesh plug from CarPart_Control to In Mesh on this interim shape like so:


    Now, anything that you do to the control cage gets piped out to the smooth proxy, this includes any geometry edits like bevels or extrudes. The proxy is what you'll shrink wrap your pinchymesh to.

    I probably made this sound more complicated than it needs to be, but it's a simple step really. We also have a built-in Subdiv Proxy which does nearly the same thing, which I was originally going to suggest. But I found that the shrinkwrap responds very poorly, if at all to any sort of cage edits. Hope this helps!
    Seems interesting but what this method doesn't offer from what I can see is the ability to decide which polygons from the mesh exactly get shrinkwrapped, as it can be signed in blender under "vertex group", but this is quite interesting, seems less intuitive than blender though but will try it as soon as I can :)
  • throttlekitty
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    Nerono said:
    Seems interesting but what this method doesn't offer from what I can see is the ability to decide which polygons from the mesh exactly get shrinkwrapped, as it can be signed in blender under "vertex group", but this is quite interesting, seems less intuitive than blender though but will try it as soon as I can :)
    I knew there was something that I forgot! You can paint weights for most deformers, including shrinkwrap. We have selection sets, but not a way to directly reference them like in blender; any workflow using them would look like "get selection from the saved set, then do the thing".

    https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/maya/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2016/ENU/Maya/files/GUID-C8D52151-9DA0-4CDD-BA8F-AB5ACAA09720-htm.html

    And yeah, not as intuitive as blenders layout in this case, but it's a goofy workflow to begin with. :)
  • FourtyNights
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    FourtyNights polycounter
    Nerono said:
    Man, you just literally ignored everything I wrote and just posted a video about "how to shrinkkwrap", don't try to make it look as if you are trying to help, do both of us a favor.
    Dude, work on your attitude. Even though he didn't help you the way you wanted, you just lost a bit of your reputation in the video game industry by being a dick.

    You could've said something like "I'm sorry, but that's not what I'm looking for, but thanks anyway. Anyone else have some tips and tricks to get that Blender-ish workflow?", and you'd still be respected here. Not saying that you ruined your career with what you just said, but that was a red flag already.

    Coming back to topic, stick with Blender for that workflow, because it seems to be the best option. You can import your model back to Maya if you want to keep learning it for other things it might handle better. If you're originally a Maya user, this helps you to make Blender to work more like Maya:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12fqTUyDts0

    Last advise, be a nice guy in the future, and you'll be fine.
  • Nerono
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    Nerono polycounter lvl 5
    Nerono said:
    Man, you just literally ignored everything I wrote and just posted a video about "how to shrinkkwrap", don't try to make it look as if you are trying to help, do both of us a favor.
    Dude, work on your attitude. Even though he didn't help you the way you wanted, you just lost a bit of your reputation in the video game industry by being a dick.

    You could've said something like "I'm sorry, but that's not what I'm looking for, but thanks anyway. Anyone else have some tips and tricks to get that Blender-ish workflow?", and you'd still be respected here. Not saying that you ruined your career with what you just said, but that was a red flag already.

    Coming back to topic, stick with Blender for that workflow, because it seems to be the best option. You can import your model back to Maya if you want to keep learning it for other things it might handle better. If you're originally a Maya user, this helps you to make Blender to work more like Maya:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12fqTUyDts0

    Last advise, be a nice guy in the future, and you'll be fine.
    Thank you for the tip but in this case I felt it was appropriate, you could see from the content of his comment and from the fact he completely neglected the actual content of my post that he was mocking me, trying to hint I did not do my research at all. He did not put any time or effort to his comment, its sole purpose was in a nutshell to tell me "go do your research first you lazy piece of shit". His comment and approach was disrespectful and therefor my answer was at the same tone.
    Disrespect leads to disrespect, think of peoples motive to saying something before commenting about it, do this in the future and you will be fine.
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