DMC - Where's the love?
polycounter lvl 11
So I've had this grip for quite sometime now. Ever since the original CG trailer was released I've seen an abundance of hate going towards the game, most of which spawns from something so minuscule; hair.
Before I start my rant, just take a look at some of the screenshots and the E3 2011 trailer:
VIDEO LINK: [ame]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GixCzw9vjek[/ame]
Tell me that doesn't look badass..
I understand the argument that this isn't the original Devil May Cry that fans have come to adore over the years, nor is it being made by Capcom, the original developers of the franchise, but how can so many people be blatantly disregarding how awesome this game looks? If the game had stayed the same, I'm sure we'd see people complaining the fact that its "just another Devil May Cry game", and now that they try and portray it in a different light, people complain that it's not the same..
In a time where we are constantly surrounded by re-boots and re-imaginings, why are people so afraid of change? (This doesn't mean I'm for everything being "re-imagined", but I can safely say that The Dark Knight was epic) The gameplay looks fantastic (even in such an early state), the visuals are mind-bending, and it's being developed by Ninja Theory, an amazing western developer.
Hopefully I'll find that I'm "preaching to the choir" on this, but let's see what everyone has to say..
Before I start my rant, just take a look at some of the screenshots and the E3 2011 trailer:
VIDEO LINK: [ame]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GixCzw9vjek[/ame]Tell me that doesn't look badass..
I understand the argument that this isn't the original Devil May Cry that fans have come to adore over the years, nor is it being made by Capcom, the original developers of the franchise, but how can so many people be blatantly disregarding how awesome this game looks? If the game had stayed the same, I'm sure we'd see people complaining the fact that its "just another Devil May Cry game", and now that they try and portray it in a different light, people complain that it's not the same..
In a time where we are constantly surrounded by re-boots and re-imaginings, why are people so afraid of change? (This doesn't mean I'm for everything being "re-imagined", but I can safely say that The Dark Knight was epic) The gameplay looks fantastic (even in such an early state), the visuals are mind-bending, and it's being developed by Ninja Theory, an amazing western developer.
Hopefully I'll find that I'm "preaching to the choir" on this, but let's see what everyone has to say..
FIGHT!
Replies
finally someone i can cosplay as!
Not only has the atmosphere been ruined (which will have a negative impact on the storytelling and the story itself), but the graphics don't even stack up to DmC 4.
Sad.
Also the new Dante looks ridiculous. Really lost most of his style through the new character design. I bet they're going to make his personality akin to that of a 'rebellious youth' which will be fucking annoying too.
At least the gameplay looks pretty fun, but due to the reasons above it is hard to consider this as part of the DmC series.
If dante isn't the cocky, confident bastard he's always been, then I'll have a problem.
Because that's what dante is.
Most people just seem to be upset because their sexy wee-aboo man-crush doesn't have flowing white locks anymore.
In the video when he goes into devil mode, his hair turns white. Leads me to believe he dyes his hair black or something to hide the demonic heritage, which will probably factor into the story.
M'Fuckers need to calm down and just see how it plays out before 'boycotting' it.
Christ.
[ame]
If it wasn't a DMC reboot, but it was still exactly the same, would you still hate it?
Probably not. So enjoy the game. It's a glorified version of our Brawl contest in a complete game form.
-The lead of Ninja Theory has essentially replaced Dante with himself (look up on google a picture of him).
-Dantes design doesn't suit him. in DMC1, he wore proper, DMC2 he wore proper, DMC3, he looked like what he should be doing and in DMC4, middle age crisis design...this one doesn't fit.
-DMC3 had rebellious youth agenda too, but with the pictures of him being bruised and in prison, I can already see the Twilight Badass attitude everyone wants.
-Monster designs don't help, the first couple were OK, the next looked to Evangelion lacking form and the last one was too "Hey, lets attach spheres and teapots and call it a day".
-The gameplay doesn't look anything off the bat new, and looks solid, but I already see the tired old formula of dodge, wait, expose core, attack.
-The emo'ness of the blood writing on walls sounding like something out of a teenagers diary is heinous, alongside the music.
-Graphics aren't important, but DMC4 ran VERY WELL on my old laptop of 3/4 years ago, so why they toned down stuff doesn't make sense.
-That city is of the same city of DMC2...brings back only bad memories.
No offense to anyone who worked on this game, and I wish the guys the best, but Team Ninja should do their own IP, and not keep on sexualizing all the and everything they touch.
not much to say about the gameplay, looks alright so far put to early to say.
If you want to appeal to a wider audience by reinventing a game, do so with half a brain.
now, so many fans of DMC have come to love Dante as he was, our white haired, punked out, bad ass.
then consider the new people, experiencing DMC for the first time, sure its great, no reason to hate it.
do you see the problem here? the original audience is lost! And the new audience is none the wiser as to why.
let me shed some clearer light on this, (note all of this is for examples sake, dont take the names seriously.)
lets take mario, someone wants to reinvent mario for a wider audience.
changing mario would upset the original fans. Where new fans would be none the wiser.
Lets fix this by making, Luigi, a new twist on mario, while not defiling mario himself.
The new fans would be none the wiser. Where the old fans, at least know the character they fell in love with is same old same old.
TL;DR?
If you want to reinvent a series, do so with new characters, changing a main character is always going to have someone upset.
Changing the games focus from one character to another may upset some people, but nowhere near as much as if the main character is change.
The new spyro game, why do people hate the looks of it? because spyro looks angry and evil. However if it wasn't spyro, it would be accepted for its gameplay and general design.
Crash Bandicoot when he couldn't spin and had a high pitch voice, if it wasn't Crash Bandicoot it may have been judged on how it played rather than how a silent protagonist became a high pitch disgrace.
Theres a huge list, but I think my point is clear enough.
We don't hate the game because his hair is wemo and he looks scrawny as hell. We hate it because its DANTE with the wemo hair and the srawniness.
Pointless generalizations like that make you seem rather childish. Grow up and learn to respect that others have different opinions than yourself.
sorry rexM, I think what he meant to say is that people are upset because he's forced to wear a shirt and you can't ogle his nipples anymore.
Damn that was one serious outfit there. Not emo or angsty or man-whorey at all.
also the most important part : his personality, cocky cheesy bastard.
it look amnazing tho, maybe will be in my shopping list.
/begin rant
But you wont ever please everyone, this is hyper exxagerated when you tinker with iconic game heroes / heroines. I think its a risky undertaking to give an iconic character a makeover / do-over. Your asking for hate no doubt about it.
There's a hell of a lot of things you have to get right, and only a select few things you can change incrementally over a long period of time to kind of.... evolve the character and have people warm to it gradually.
From first to last its still lara, right down the belt buckles. but subtle nuances are gradually evolving her into a more realistic looking lara.
Throw in the new lara:
You could say that this isnt lara, but I still see lara in the eyes, eyebrows, hair bangs, ponytail, lips and her practical choice of clothing and hairstyle, theyve brought her forward into the future but kept the core lara values the same or very similar, though I could also sympathise with people that say this isnt lara anymore.
But no matter how hard I try, this new version doesnt say Dante to me AT ALL , its so completely out of his character except for maybe the long trenchcoaty silhouette, but that could really be anyone.
For starters in terms of the big things, proportions are different, the fashion sense is off the charts different. Im hoping like hell they didnt change his personality otherwise it may as well be a completely new hero alltogether.
Small things like the face structure is completely different. The flare in the clothing design is non existant. Theres a new overall 'ruggedness' to his look which simply has never existed before.
We could so easily call this guy Reginald and the game a new ip HellScythe! And noone would ever look at reginald and go.. 'Hey you know what? Reginald looks an awful lot like Dante from DMC' But they'd definitely say the game was a DMC clone.
I can sum this change up by saying Dante has gone from a an eastern stylised action hero built for a somewhat global audiance, to a western stylised action hero built for western audiance, and that difference is extremely jarring for some long time fans of DMC.
Also, I say eastern stylised action hero built for a somewhat global audiance because alot of the west tends to think dante is a bit of a girly man, and maybe he is standing next to Marcus Fenix, but if your an eastern anime fan trust me, hes definitely been quite westernised as far as male protagonist / heroes go.
And to the folks who say stuff like 'oh well i cant understand why people are pissed ' I dont understand WHY you cant understand, its pretty easy to comprehend I would have thought.. no ?
If epic let another studio make the next gears of war, and they took Marcus Fenix, lost the bandanna, let him grow out some long lucious flowing locks that were swept to one side covering half of his face emo style, starved him for a couple of months on a vegan diet so he lost his bulk, pampered him in day spa's to smooth out his complexion and then dressed him in some hip clothes - to look more like the studio lead in charge of this fictional new gears of war title, you'd be the person complaining, and then we would be those guys saying 'eat it up bitch'.
Having said all that, I dont really care, I'm still buying the game and I'm still playing it because I like devil may cry and I like what ninja theory do as a team. So mad props to them, for taking on this crazy challenge. I look forward to playing and beating the game hopefully prooving me totally and utterly wrong, and ultimately loving the new take on Dante.
P.S Note to Epic: Please never do that to Marcus Fenix.
I can't say I'm happy about it, but honestly the feel of DMC changed a lot from 1 to 2. And by 3 I tried to stay in but 4 hours was all I could muster.
4, if they took it back to the feeling of 1 I'd be all over it. However, the redesign does a lot to tell me it wont be. You can't be emo and a cock-sure, balls to the walls badass. They are are two character elements that clash heavily.
Yeah, anime has the emo badass, but they aren't the same kind of cocky that Dante was, and that character type is suited for the empathetic or heartless villan, not the main character of an action game franchise.
But maybe I'm just getting to old? Now if you'll excuse me I have some kids to go chase off my lawn.
Also, +1 hazardous
(and i could always be totally wrong, actual gameplay and story can impact the feel of anything more heavily than some screen footage and still shots.)
I wanna see Kingdom Hearts: Bieber'd, Beloved & Belieber'd now, just to make things crazier.
@ Hazardous
lold irl at the Epic part
previous DMC5 trailer
So many fucking emo asians errywhar
goddam emo politicians
What with their black hair.
<_<
Loooking at the newest stuff, it has changed a good bit from the initial, its not as bad as it was.
Granted, they were complaining about the one thing we had seen, which was Dante, but IMO it shouldnt be such a big deal.
Dante was and will always be defined by his attitude. I may not dig the gameplay as much anymore, but the character was awesome. It was the original choices in the character redesign that made me -.-, but for the most part I have gotten past it, or rather am able to overlook my dislike for it.
Everything evolves, and it could be a good change. Like I mentioned in my first post, his story, the new gameplay and his persona (which better be the damn same) are what will make the game. Not his appearance.
And by anime emo, I meant the always sad gloomy villain. Not characters in general :P
Something to do with an illusory city of some sort, possibly a big brother thing. Maybe Dante has to hide his demonic heritage by dying his hair black, because as you see, it's white when he goes into that Devil mode (forget what it's actually called) so i'm sure it will all make better sense when we see the full game. And I hope he keeps his personality, because that is, indeed, what made him. He just didn't give a fuck. He knew he could win.
Dude. That was badass. XD
aesir - HAHAHAHAHA I about died laughing when I read that, I'm right with you on how "serious and non-angsty" the old Dante looked. I feel like some people are wearing blinders, and they won't like DmC until Dante looks nearly identical. That is why there are 4 Devil May Cry games though...
xvampire - The hair takes up just a fraction of the screen, and is probably the last thing you look at when fighting off tons of enemies, just sayin
Hazardous - Normally I would agree with you about such radical changes, but we have to keep in mind that this isn't supposed to represent Dante as we saw him in all the previous titles, this is a younger version of Dante all together. I feel they had to change his look somewhat drastically, but if you look at both designs, there are still definitely similarities.
ikken - Bigger fanbase = more money. Gaming is still a business, and I'm sure after Enslaved flopped (have no idea why, I really enjoyed that game) they needed something that would attract more of a crowd.
Grimm_Wrecking - The original Dante also had quite an "emo" haircut:
ZacD - Agreed, the environments are wicked, and I love how they shift and change.
I love the direction, and I'm glad they decided to try something "different" with Devil May Cry, at least visually. Gameplay looks solid, like all other titles, but I definitely see new elements which get me all giddy like a school girl.
We are not upset because its pathetic hair and scrawny figure.
We are upset because its Dante, an already defined character with pathetic hair and scrawny figure.
I would much prefer it if they made the new Dante a new character completely, rather than modify an already defined character.
Think mario, lets make him muscle bound and give him a thin, creepy face. Its no longer mario.
See many of us do not have a problem with the design, we have a problem with the design being Dante.
I tried DMC4 but got caught on one of those stupid puzzles where you have to have perfect timing, AND do some crazy, knuckle busting, combo at the same time, and gave up.
There's one thing that's true, I think for most people anyway, and that's that DMC has some of the coolest looking monsters/bosses ever.
ErichWK, from that statement I'm gonna assume you are over 20, and haven't been to a mall since 2002. Seriously, hit any mall in the states, and see that emo is alive and well today.
[EDIT] Forgot to mention, I think it's kinda funny that people are complaining about Dante's emo look, when that's kinda what the series offered from day one, so people should KNOW that's what they're getting in the sequels.
Personally, I like reboots and welcome them. I like change.
We are not annoyed because the hair is emo.
We are annoyed because they changed Dante,
Throughout the series he has changed little by little, fair enough.
But its kind of principle in sequel / prequel games based around a character to be able to recognize the main character if you have played before.
Changing Dante completely; Black, scraggy hair. Thin, weak face. Scrawny build.
Holds the same significance to DMC fans as it would to sonic fans if sonic team made sonic an evil rabbit.
Everyone is making the point "he looks like an emo" "but dante as always been emo" "he looks pathetic" "it keeps him up to date", etc. etc.
I've seen it all. But no. A character iconic to its series should keep their general form and recognizability.
In the mean time, I'll be considering the new Dante a different character so I may have enough will power to play it.
If it doesn't look like a duck and it doesn't sound like a duck, its not a duck.
It's difficult to argue that Ninja Theory isnt capable of creating excellent characters, and they're hardly ever two-dimensional or annoying. You'll see... You'll all see...
but to be fair, I cant judge much more without seeing story - dialogue, and more personality of this new Dante. hopefully we can see it very soon.
also most of us forgot,
Devil may cry was meant to be resident evil 3( or 2 ), its way off that capcom have to change the title .
capcom is not nintendo, they can change character image in 1 sequel. and this is not the first time they do that
Brain melt!!!!!!!!
I actually like the redesign, I think it needs some love to bring him more dante love but I think until they have him talking and stuff then its not going to show you his personality too much as we are just seeing him hit things right now. I was actually making a dante for the polycount brawl as I thought the designs keep screwing up until this one but ran out of time to have a proper go. I think Im one of the only people out there that loved dantes design in DMC2 haha but it was completely out of character for him, so character design fail!!!
DMC4 dante needs to fall down a well so I quite like this as DMC3s youngster dante seemed annoying as hell but the game was so good I didnt really mind and the soundtrack was great.
What I dont like however is the enemies and backgrounds, looks like too much influence from Bayonetta is going in, and enough of these shitty doll monsters!!!!!!! I would love them to go down a much darker demon route and the environments are just annoying, never liked street environments in these sort of games, I think it works best in castles and more rural areas.
saying that though, its Ninja Theory, and they are awesome. Loved heavenly Sword and Enslaved was amazing. My only gripe with Enslaved was that being multi platform it was a bit rough around the edges in places, so I hope it doesnt happen here too.
[ame]
What I like the most about the series is its sheer idiocy and its B-movie level of campiness. I don't mind Dante's redesign all that much. After all his old design was always ridiculous, though, in its defense, it did suit the tone of the series.
But now it seems like they are delving deep into the SERIOUS BUISINESS area. Considering how many games try that and never live up to its potential, I'm not sure if that's what the series needs.
Think about how much you've changed since you were younger! I find it ironic that when I was in highschool, I was a tad bit emo (don't judge).... and I weighed 120 lbs. Since I've been hitting the gym, I'm a full 170 and my hair doesn't have an attitude of its own.
Dante wasn't born with a developed physique. And judging by "old" dante pics, he never was huge, just well built. It's not hard to believe this younger dante could pack on a few pounds to fill into his older counterpart. And as for white hair... I'm assuming you're not born with that either. (and the new trailer shows the white hair anyway)
So he used to have a weird haircut... who cares?! The only reason it sucks so much is because the producer has it too. It's a nice change from the lady locks Japanese characters usually sport.
I guess, thats a good point. Personally I couldn't give a flying one about either camps though, that release trailer looks damn cool, but it'll probably be a rental for me nonetheless.