importance of a degree?
polycounter lvl 15
wrote up a bunch of crap but decided to shorten it a bit...
How important is a 3 year bachelor's degree?
And is it worth throwing away a years worth of actual studies (anatomy sculpts, likeness sculpts, cloth studies, etc) so you can go at a snails pace and write papers on completley irrelevant topics and do side projects that really won't do much for you in the long run?
Is me having a slightly easier time getting into certain countries worth not having the skills or portfolio to do the work the companies would actually need out of me? (kinda exagerating here but yeh :P)
How important is a 3 year bachelor's degree?
And is it worth throwing away a years worth of actual studies (anatomy sculpts, likeness sculpts, cloth studies, etc) so you can go at a snails pace and write papers on completley irrelevant topics and do side projects that really won't do much for you in the long run?
Is me having a slightly easier time getting into certain countries worth not having the skills or portfolio to do the work the companies would actually need out of me? (kinda exagerating here but yeh :P)
Replies
If you're eager to move for your first job, a degree will help you get a visa, but after you have industry experience, companies will likely pull their thumbs out to help you get across borders etc.
I've got about a year of study left, just got back from new zealand after a company hired me due to me skipping uni classes the first time around to stay home and work on my skills/portfolio (so i've got a year-ish studio experience already, and a bit more if you count freelance and i guess mod work).
Right now it feels like i can't really get any work done around my classes, and i feel i'm at a point where improving my skills for a better portfolio is vastly out-weighing wasting a year of my life (thats the perspective i've got right now at least).
Still seems like i can apply for some sort of visa's or working holidays in most places except the US which my 3 year degree isn't going to help with much anyways.
Do you need a degree to become a game artist?
Degree vs. Portfolio
The degree poll
Does a degree make a difference
To Degree or not to Degree
guess i'm just freaking out a little, like i've only got 2 (exactly 2) options right now... not true in reality but yeh, i think i know how i'mma play this.
plus it seems like both options have worked out for different peeps so i guess i'll be alright either way :poly136: (fuggin hope so O_O)
If some friendly neighbourhood mods wanna delete this thread that'd be totes approtes ^^ (sorry for the gd spam, imma stick to making the pictures instead of words)
*runs back to pnp*
I can't say for sure what the dealio is with the US but I know it does help you get visa approvals.
However I'm pretty sure if you've got the skills a company would look at sponsoring you to get you past that anyway.
If you have the money and need the time to practice then go for it. I enjoyed my time at university and it gave me "time" to practice, practice, praaaaactice. Oh and I got to work with others on a game and you don't really get that at home doing mods.
Not with the same amount of depth the 5 links provide.
If you have the coin and the time, it won't hurt. Putting off getting a job for a few years isn't all that bad in the grand scheme of things especially if it gives you skills and the time you need to put together a rocking portfolio. Which is what you should always be keeping in mind, the portfolio is king... it is your meal ticket, feed it well, grow it, protect it from stupid projects you might be tempted to stuff in there, spend lots of time with it and it MIGHT just pay off, but without it you have next to ZERO chances of landing a artist position...
Considering you'll be working a job until you grab your chest, fall on the floor and twitch wildly as your heart tries desperately to pass another cheato through an ever narrowing tube... it might be a good idea to not enter the rat race for 2-4 years after high school...
I might not be the most reliable source as I'm just a starter in 3D compared to a lot of artists out there, but if your dont feel like your evolving in your course, you might be taking the wrong subjects or gone to the wrong schools. I'm not saying this is the case with you but it can be with a lot of people.
I'm ending my first year in May and I already feel like my first year teacher has taught me all he knows in terms of the basics, so rather than complain I'm forcing myself to learn either outside of lessons or force extra rules on top of the subjects he gives me to force me evovle at my own rate, no one elses. Case and point, I have to do some character research, I base it around the brief of the Polycount Brawl Contest and I feel like I'm getting the best of both worlds.
Overall if you feel like its impossible to evolve, try and see if you can move to different major or a completely different university to take your studies in the direction YOU WANT!
I hope all goes well with your decision, and try and not worry about the degree vs no degree. Overall yes it does help, but if a company see that you put the effort in, they'll want you more than anyone else who doesn't and has that piece of paper.
Fix'd it for you
Having said that, a degree won't get you the job, your portfolio will. Now, what you learn on the degree is a matter of opinion...
You get out of college, what you put into college.
You've got a lot of talent, Nizza. A year of college isn't going to stunt that; on the contrary, you may find it helps you grow. But it's not going to be a rewarding experience if you go in with a crap attitude.
Best of luck, broseph.
As to me a degree for CG is not that important but it is always a balnce of factors tho.
I have learned everything myself, that is to say for free, faster and could already start working versus being still in university by that time. I'd rather prefer to go take some fun program later on when it'll be more of a choice of a pleasure of discovering/learning new stuff rather than necessity.
Of course there r different universities and different quality of programs.
Maybe US or some other have good ones, but from what I saw/heard for example what we have in Montreal or Quebec kinda sucks.
Their programs dont follow the industry nor its demands. It is basically old university staff professors who just take books on 3ds max or maya or whatever and read them before teaching:P Or it may be a freshly graduated student with A marks who get offerred to take over teaching some CG class...
Industry moves faster than our university game-art programs.
My girlfirend finished one here and well, while it was definitely a fun time while being a student she has her job now due to intence learning efforts done by herself after graduation :P
But, as I said, there definitely should be good univs out there, but choose carefuly. Don't get fooled by "success" demos or post-graduation hiring statistics
As far as I experienced ppl look on portfolio and experience when hiring.
Well, definitely if u have a degree in fine arts (academical though, not contemporary;)or architecture it is a good plus. After all if u r a concept artist u might wanna take a good academical drawing class anyways.
Edit: but some private schools may be of use cauz usually it takes less time and in a good one (again, sucky ones exsit) u'll be taught by an industry pro.
My 2 cents, your mileage may vary.
Depends entirely where you are from. If you are from the US and have no intention of ever moving, yeah, a degree might not mean a lot to you. For me, I'm the exact opposite of what you stated there. I like knowing I have the option to work and travel anywhere in the world for months at a time if I choose, and for the last two jobs I've had in this industry, I didn't even interview or show a portfolio!
90% of people I see posting pretty much this don't have a degree themselves, or are bitter towards their college for 'teaching them nothing'... a piece of paper can be a lot of things; in this case its a ticket if you want to experience this world and see as many countries as you want while earning along the way (and being able to stay for a longish time, cause you can get a visa). Plus, I had A LOT of fun in college
Very true. You are very talented nizza. And you do get out of it what you put in.
Well, now I would surely say that I think for a job u do not need any university/college
I had a fairly mediocre time all around first time through. Conversley, my first industry job was awsome. Met some of the coolest people in my life and had some awsome times.
The only thing that's really bugging me, is the travelling might not be as easy, tho it still seems possible. I just hate the fact that i'd have to waste so much time and energy on finishing my degree.
I might be a bit impatient when it comes to this too. I just wanna get alot better right now.
On the plus side tho canada still seems accessable for at least a year (give or take) without a degree, and i imagine having a company there back me up if my skills were good enough would definitley help.
That and my dad's polish... so i can apply for a polish passport apparently (means free uk/europe, yeah? ^^).
The US is kindof off limits i guess, but i'd need to tack on an extra year of uni to get a masters... and i think i'd gladly take 10 years in the industry elsewhere over that
if user = "other" then degree = 95% must have!
Reason for this is simple. American immigration law is made of sadness and whipped kittens in the fires and brimstone by the demons of evilness so getting in without one is hard unless you're a rockstar.
For getting a job a degree means fuck all. Would be worth more as backup toilet paper on your way to the interview. These are my opinions, silly as they may be.
I'm doing the design parallel of your degree.
The RMIT games course is supposed to be rated as one of the best in the southern hemisphere and, if you work hard, you'll come out with a a great folio anyway (looks like yours is pretty well developed as is).
I am just going to try and make the most out of my time and work on as many of my own projects as possible. I do find that the game "design" courses" should really be called game art though.
Thing is i do this already (learning rigging/animation, basic coding junk, pixel art, etc). Right now i gotta improve my basic skills tho, and push that other stuff to the side (only way my folio and job prospects are gonna improve right now)
Plus it's going at a pretty slow pace compared to what i'd be comfortable with, but that happens i guess.
And dunno why but it's proving rly hard to do both at the same time
ergo:
Polycount should give degree's
a few other forums helped but this thread isn't at those forums
So if you have one year of schooling you will need 9 years of work exp to get say the E-3 in the usa. (this info may be old now)
If your goal is to get out of the country and work overseas, you should think about that now and make prep for it. School is a means to this end faster than working would be. And its not like you will be sacrificing portfolio time away from it because you can do that on your off days/weekends and copious holidays.
If I had known this information sooner I probably would have stayed an extra year or two and finished my degree at qantm.
It's a good course and there's no doubt that I'm going to stick it out, but I can't wait to work towards some real world results.
I went through all of this back at the end of 2009 being one of those artists who never got a degree and relocating to the US.
A degree will honestly make your life much easier in the short term until youve got about 9 - 12 years of documented experience under your belt, by documented that basically means letters of employment, endorsement letters from freelance clients that can be tallied to make up minimum entry requirements.
You can surely opt to not get a degree, but be prepared to be planted solid where you are - again no matter who the company is, they cant bend immigration.
I mentioned this once before, but you know marko djurdjevic right ? he doesnt have a degree, and he told us about when he didnt have the credentials to get into the US... he was already doing marvel covers etc!! That pretty much sums it up I think.
looking at it now I would really be locking myself in, and 9+ years might be a bit longer than I first thought (actually seems like a while, dunno what I was thinking then :P).
And there really are a lot more studios in America, so at least having the option (as well as Canada and the UK/Europe) would be nice to have.
Still gotta talk to the course coordinator and work some stuff out. I'm still not 100% but I guess plowing through this work right now, uploading it to the network and never going in till next semester could work out for me (with at least a passing grade in these subjects). I'll see how it goes ^^ (and there really aren't that many classes I have left to do after work experience credits)
Currently I'm doing a diploma for multimedia/digital media and I'm going to finish around June. Now I'm deciding between doing an advanced diploma in digital media or get a game art degree over at RMIT during mid-year.
The problem was the length of the courses, adv. dip. goes for 1 year where as the degree goes for 3. I didn't really want to spend so much time studying stuff that I possibly already know.
So if I want to expand my work possibilities, I should do the degree?
Also find out if having a diploma and an advanced diploma will be of any additional benefit.
You need to be super careful here as MANY foreign diplomas are not even recognized in the US, and will NOT be counted toward your total years of schooling / experience, however a far greater number of degrees are.
Its worth checking out, especially if your serious about heading overseas.
Hehe, damn right Nizza. I remember before I just started my Comm Design degree this year I thought, "Yeah since I'm not working and I'm going to uni being all creative and shit I'll have tonnes of time to work on my 3d and games design!"
Seriously I haven't had time to play a game, talk to friends, cook food or clean anything in like 4 weeks., not to mention improve gamedev skills. Just friggin study.
Many people who actually have done the animation degree programs will tell you that its balls, and that it is a waste of time, and I know it is. But, if you think about it, when you are starting up your personal studies, the online tutorials, anatomy books, and reference books will help you enough to get things started.
I still think that after doing the degree program I should go and atleast take 1-2 year worth of diploma for 3d animation and life drawing courses. That should help me alot in terms of refining my personal studies and get an in depth idea of how to make reference images for my 3d model, how to create concept arts, scene story boards, and few other things that you do not get to learn when you are doing your personal studies.
The rest alone depends on you on how you are going to take it further.
Though, degree programs do have end year projects, and co-op / job placement programs which will definitely help you in terms of creating your own network to get a job.
If you expect it to land you a job and teach you the things you need to know to become a competent artist you will fail.
If you attend with motivation knowing you need to push yourself and realize that your education is a tool and stepping stone to your career, then you will succeed.
My path so far has been nothing but hard work. When I graduated high school, I was terrible at everything and couldn't get into any college. So I went off to the Marines for a term, got some money, and then allowed time to realize what I wanted to do in life.
When I went to AI, I went in with absolutely no art skills and no idea wtf to do.
I only found Polycount because I saw another student at AI lurking the forums.
So in essence, if it wasn't for AI I wouldn't even have known Polycount have existed.Strange how things work out.
Always push yourself.
Sometimes I feel like I'm wasting my time on graphic design college classes, while I could be studying more relevant game art subjects. Due to college + fulltime work at a studio, the time for personal study goes critically low.
In other hand I believe that is important to have good foundations. But most important is to have that diploma and wear of that weight on the back..
I have something like two friends from my studio who lost oportunities in canada due to lack of college diploma!
Sometimes is good to go easy with anxiety and plan medium term goals.
my 1 cent