Used to have a pirated version of Photoshop, but got it legally when I started being serious about CG. I also have a legal copy of Maya, but I prefer to use Blender.
And I used to use Gmax! GMAX! If that isn't decency, I don't know what is.
Well if I go all the way back to my school days until now I'd have to say I've done all of those. Once I began freelancing it was quite a challenge to stay 100% legit. I just bought Modo so hopefully I can stay away from giving any more of my $ to Autodesk for a while. Luckily I got a copy of Photoshop CS2 and Maya from a place I worked at in the past. Since CS2 still does what I need it to do I probably won't be upgrading for some time. I just wish Crazy Bump was cheaper I'm still using the Nvidia filter for all my normal map processing LOL. The worst experience I've had so far buying while my apps was when Mudbox 2009 came out I couldn't download it from the links Autodesk sent me, then to top it off after the links were fixed I couldn't activate it for a few days because they messed up my account info. Meanwhile I'm sure the pirates had no problems whatsoever and were enjoying their copies of Mudbox 2009 LOL!
2D/3D companies would be better off offering free educational software to get people to work with their products. Most of us did start with pirated versions I assume, but will buy the full product when they get more serious.
2D/3D companies would be better off offering free educational software to get people to work with their products. Most of us did start with pirated versions I assume, but will buy the full product when they get more serious.
Why bother? Piracy provides them just as much exposure and does an even better job of keeping potential competition from getting its foot in the door.
Why bother? Piracy provides them just as much exposure and does an even better job of keeping potential competition from getting its foot in the door.
Why bother? Just to give of the signal it's OK to download "legal" personal learning editions that are easy to install instead of having to look them up illegally, and have to get a keygenerator that is likely to contain a virus as a bonus.
Having an open door towards people who are interested in your software really pays IMO, just pay when you intend to use the software for anything besides personal use.
Even a small fee would be fine. I'd buy most software if it was around $100, but there's no way I'd be paying more than 300 for a thing I can't try first.
I wonder if all the people who didn't pirate Maya/Max etc to learn would be working in the industry today with a company who pays for legit licences eh.
Why bother? Just to give of the signal it's OK to download "legal" personal learning editions that are easy to install instead of having to look them up illegally, and have to get a keygenerator that is likely to contain a virus as a bonus.
Having an open door towards people who are interested in your software really pays IMO, just pay when you intend to use the software for anything besides personal use.
Even a small fee would be fine. I'd buy most software if it was around $100, but there's no way I'd be paying more than 300 for a thing I can't try first.
The only type of limited version that would be effective is one that is identical to the full version but is not legal to use for anything but personal work. However, this is pretty much how pirated software is already seen, so all that would change is they loose money from educational sales to students.
If they put out a gimped demo people will still pirate the full version. This applies double to new users who dont even know what features they need and assume that the magic 'make my stuff awesome' button is hidden somewhere in only the most expensive and full featured software.
Well, according to most cases around piracy, every copy downloaded is a copy normally bought and paid for. Of course, this is utter nonsense, but tell that to the people who file charges...
Well I use pirated copies of photoshop and max and honestly I don't think adobe/autodesk gives a shit. They target corporate licenses, not personal licenses.
That's the reason their software is so easy to crack. It's good business for them if people like us download illegal copies, learn the software and when we get hired our company purchases corporate licenses. The more people are proficient with their software the more standard they will become and more companies will buy them. Microsoft used the same strategy back in the 80s, they basically gave away windows copies to PC manufacturers so their install base would grow and their product become standard.
Personally I'd love to buy these softwares but personal licenses are way too expensive and not really worth it in my opinion.
i also started with GMAX! what a shitty program it was. then i got a cracked version of max 6 and photoshop. In fact, ive had the same cracked version of photoshop all these years, it still works like a charm.
i would NEVER pay out of my own pocket for an autodesk or adobe product. autodesk, because every version introduces new bugs and they never fix their old bugs. adobe because they think theyre so high and mighty they can charge an arm and a leg for their cheap ass sowftware that does the same thing as their cheap as software back in 1999. also, their cover art is getting worse and worse.
Got my first copies of max and photoshop from an ftp site that I got from a 0-day text list from an irc warez channel. That was probably 10-11 years ago.
I'm curious about "pirated, then got a legal copy from a studio i was working on". There are a lot of hits on that option, so are studios buying you guys home copies of software? You understand that just taking a copy from work and installing it at home is just as illegal as downloading it in the first place right?
Most of us are starting, or started young, most kids don't sit a top a pile of money as they read this. You already need to have to have a decent PC, probably a tablet, pencils/paint/paper, etc, not to mention the whole cost of, ya know "you eating" it's shouldn't be a surprising that people want to start learning right away instead of slaving away to buy 1000s of dollars worth of programs, that they'll probably have to end up buying anyway once they have a job, and companies still shell out the doe for multiple copies.
Denny's just doesn't get you that Porsche.
The people who developed the programs definatly deserve their pay, but honestly using the products to learn free and buying them later, doesn't seem any different than going through the trouble of signing up for a free trail every 30 days.
commercial software is priced on the assumption that you're buying it for buisness and you're going to make money with it, games are not. not the same thing
Yet everyone gets all mad about the latter while making excuses for the former
Because this is not a software engineering forum, it is a game art forum. We are obviously going to be a lot more outspoken about stuff that damages our particular industry.
Because this is not a software engineering forum, it is a game art forum. We are obviously going to be a lot more outspoken about stuff that damages our particular industry.
I guess not having tools would be good for the industry?
Or maybe people act differently because it is entirely different.
Because this is not a software engineering forum, it is a game art forum. We are obviously going to be a lot more outspoken about stuff that damages our particular industry.
Exactly right. People here will justify their pirating software but not games because they make games and not software. Cognitive dissonance, m8s
The reasons people give for pirating software and for games are similar - overpriced, not terribly good support anyway, only with games they also have the excuse of dodging DRM. The only real difference is that pirating games is larceny and pirating software is grand larceny - either way you're using something under conditions that you are not legally allowed to use it under, you're stealing and that's all there is to it. You can justify it to yourself however you want but that ultimately only makes you feel better
I personally don't really care either way, I don't judge pirates and I have been one myself, but I do find all the excuses people come up with for it pretty sad. It's theft. You do it because you don't want to pay for the product. End of story.
Most of us are starting, or started young, most kids don't sit a top a pile of money as they read this. You already need to have to have a decent PC, probably a tablet, pencils/paint/paper, etc, not to mention the whole cost of, ya know "you eating" it's shouldn't be a surprising that people want to start learning right away instead of slaving away to buy 1000s of dollars worth of programs, that they'll probably have to end up buying anyway once they have a job, and companies still shell out the doe for multiple copies.
Denny's just doesn't get you that Porsche.
So you should steal that Porsche!
I took out a loan and bought max and a tablet, etc. That's what you do when you want to spend money you don't have.
So. For many years I'd been using Photoshop, downloaded by my brothers on the family computer. I hadn't done any 3D before, and somewhat recently I signed up for this crazy education that used XSI. "Well," I thought "I'll download it and check it out so I can say I have some experience when I ride down for the interview!" But of course, I didn't understand jack about the program.
Education started, and eventually we actually got a copy each of XSI 5.0. Woo! Then the education ended, and I was stuck somewhere else... but I got an internship there, at a place that used Maya. "Well," I thought, "I'll download it and learn more from home so we don't have to waste work time educating me."
So. They bought in more licenses at work, and I was promised a job. But things turned sour, another skilled intern showed up and the economy only allowed them to hire one person at that period in time. Straws were drawn and I went back home.
Desperate for work, I eventually found a company that I could sneak in some time for from the comfort of my own home. Problem is, they used Max. So I "borrowed" it from a workmate via the magic of the Internet. If we worked in the same building, we could easily share one copy, but unfortunately we're too far away.
Short story, I used XSI illegally, then legally. Then I used Maya illegally, then legally, and now illegally again. And I'm currently using Max illegally, but if things go well I'll use it legally in the future. And frankly I don't see myself buying either for private use any time soon. I kinda am considering Photoshop... but first there's another piece of software I wish to use more and has more promising prospects; FL Studios, for music making. Pay once, free updates for life! Once I can afford that I might start saving up for one of the graphics packages... or a Cintiq.
But first I need a stable job. For the first time in my entire life. Until then, everything I can afford to pay for except food and housing, I consider luxury.
If stealing a car leads me to a well paying job driving the car legally purchased by my new employer...FUCK YEAH I WILL STEAL IT!
That said, I have mixed feeling about piracy.
I DO NOT download games. I don't think there is any reason to. Yes games are expensive when they're released...and many gamers are like kids in a candy store. They must have it NOW. Me, I say most games are worth the price. Others...well, those games suck, were made by poor designers, or their publisher's demands, and will be in the bargain bin in only a couple months. You can wait that long to pay a reasonable price for the experience it gives you. Also, demos. Game demos have saved me TONS of cash, by showing me what games are simply not worth buying...or playing...ever.
That said, I think everyone who downloaded Spore is justified in their actions. I say this as someone who has a legally paid copy of the game, and no longer plays it. The event of making Spore the highest download game in history sent EA a clear message, which is evident in their plans for releasing TheSims3. Stop screwing the consumer, or they will screw you.
I believe software piracy, and the reasons behind it are a different topic...slighty. The game industry is a big, quickly advancing industry. Autodesk is already rolling in the cash from the amount they get from studios purchasing license. The more people educated in the software, the more using it for commercial purposes within legal bounds. I don't think Autodesk, Autodesk, or Autodesk are fearing any financial loss because students and hobbyist choose to download Max, Maya, or XSI. The fact they now own the industry without competition is clear.
Many years ago, I chose to take what I thought was the high road. I bought a legal license to XSI, a new cheaper version for gamers and hobbyist. I loved the software, I loved the work flow it encouraged. It allowed me to work on many projects, some commercial, without guilt. But, as stated above, the industry uses other types of software as their pipeline. Most Max, some Maya. To open up all your opportunities within the industry would require you having knowledge of all three major apps. No one can afford all three. As years past by, and game technology quickly advanced, my legal version of XSI become more and more obsolete. It no longer installs from my original disk, and must be installed from a fixed version, that cannot be found on the company website. Finally the company stopped supporting it, and stopped offering it all together. And then they were bought by Autodesk. In my job search, I've found that my knowledge of the software gets me no where. So, I've been spending my time migrating all of what I know of one application, to the others...which seems like the best strategy given the circumstances. I mean, really, how many get anywhere forcing themselves to use Blender. :P Gmax was a great idea, implemented poorly, and it really sucked. It's how I first learned Max, and learned to hate it. Maya PLE was ok, but not useful. Mod Tool is awesome...but, likely to be sent the way of the other two thanks to Autodesk.
I've always had a legal version of Photoshop 6. I've pirated newer versions of Photoshop in the past, only to find they're MISSING useful features that older versions had. Even the newest versions have disabled thumbnails in Explorer, to encourage the use of Bridge. I have free image viewing software that works great tho.
On one end, people should not pirate software, games, movies just because they can, or think it's cool. On the other, the actions of major companies towards their consumers and hobbyist, and the challenges students face in an educational system that falls behind...encourages it.
I took out a loan and bought max and a tablet, etc. That's what you do when you want to spend money you don't have.
But see, I didn't take out a loan, and now I have max, and a tablet, etc. I know it's stealing, I guess I'm kind of a dick sometimes, but, well shit, honestly I don't care right now, I just want to learn... and I'm cheap. (actually I didn't steal the physical stuff)
Didn't think as many people would take this guy's approach--->
Side-note: Can you write this stuff off on your taxes? It seems like you should be able to.
But see, I didn't take out a loan, and now I have max, and a tablet, etc. I know it's stealing, I guess I'm kind of a dick sometimes, but, well shit, honestly I don't care right now, I just want to learn... and I'm cheap. (actually I didn't steal the physical stuff)
Didn't think as many people would take this guy's approach--->
Side-note: Can you write this stuff off on your taxes? It seems like you should be able to.
"YAR HAR, SHIVER ME DIGITAL TIMBERS!"
If you're self-employed you can write off tons of shit on your taxes, partiall rent, utilities, internet, hardware, software, etc. If you're buying software to do stuff in your free time, and its not you main source of income, then no.
But see, I didn't take out a loan, and now I have max, and a tablet, etc. I know it's stealing, I guess I'm kind of a dick sometimes, but, well shit, honestly I don't care right now, I just want to learn... and I'm cheap. (actually I didn't steal the physical stuff)
Yeah, it all comes down to personal ethics. If you're fine stealing/pirating whatever, then that's what you'll do. At the time it was important to me that I did things legitimately. If you just want shit and don't care, there's no argument anyone can make that will make any difference.
All I'd want is that you're as understanding when the tables are turned.
Hasn't the official policy on Polycount always kind of been "don't ask, don't tell?" I'd rather not see these types of discussions on here. All it does is help ease the conscience of people who are pirating because they can tell themselves "everyone else does it" while irritating people who actually paid for the software because they feel it is unfair. Not a good topic for discussion, IMO.
Side-note: Can you write this stuff off on your taxes? It seems like you should be able to.
That gets really tricky. Its easy for the gov to find a way to kick it off your taxes, they have half a dozen reasons why and some really rough criteria to meet in order for to claim it. Because its such a large amount it sends of giant signal flares and almost always takes weeks to clear up. Now taking your tax return and applying toward the purchase of that software does help to go a long way in covering the cost depending on how big your returns are.
Mammoth software like Max are targeted at professional individuals or companies ; ie folks making money out their use of the program.
A person downloading a non-legit copy of the program is not making a dime out of it. That person is either is a noob, or still learning, or a hobbyist aiming at becoming a professional one day.
In that regard, such individuals don't even fit inside the user target audience the app is tailored for. They are not stealing from Autodesk since Autodesk does not consider them as a source of revenue in the first place anyways! Do you see any advertising on the Autodesk website saying 'Easy to use interface for the driven hobbyist!' ?
To such persons the app should be free in my opinion.
About student versions of the programs : I think this is a huge load of crap. No student should have to pay for a 3D app, It should be provided by the school - there would be a student pricing, but not payed by the student - paid by the university/school as a bulk site license instead.
Officially the system ain't like that (on paper) but in reality this is how it works (except for the uni thing. I don't believe students really buy Max huh) and i think it's fine, and Autodesk knows it very well...
(I don't even mention the dark ages when medium companies where using hacked apps : it's long gone and just not worth the risk).
I think you're on the money pior.. As soon as autodesk released mudbox 2 they killed the non commercial version, which seems to indicate their disinterest in the hobbyist segment. My guess is it's peanuts to them?
yep i think priors hit the nail there. not having a cheap personal use version must also make it easier for them to police small companies that possibly would go the route of having a few of those and one or two propper liscences to author it, or at least to say theyve got a propper lisence
interesting read http://www.devlounge.net/articles/piracy-adobe’s-best-friend
same applies to Office from microsoft,- without the horde of people that wanted the software they used at their office also at home Office wouldn't have the marketshare it has today. The very same reason is why it's gone backwards for Office the last years because OpenOffice the free alternative offers the same functionality people need at home. But it's of course also because many Institutions and Companies want to save Money with avoiding Office in favor of OpenOffice.
Adobe can be happy because Gimp the counterpart of Photoshop in the OS scene is yet to crappy to be used in the professional area which usually dictates Universities and schools what to learn for.
It will be imo. interesting to see how Blender develops in regards of this- it might actually steal a tiny market share or at least licenses from smaller studios. If not already today - I think it will at some point be a serious alternative to some developers and studios.
Besides what has been already discussed here I think that many buisness models from Companies such as Microsoft and Adobe (autodesk probably not) will be changing in the near future.
Booth Microsoft, Google, Adobe, OnLive and many small new commers are already experimenting with cloud computing and Online driven applications (read RIA = rich internet application). The next Office from Microsoft tries to defend exactly what I have been illustrating before - getting the consumer and casual users back from OpenOffice and Pirated software by releasing the Software with Ads or small fees per use/month,...
Same for Adobe who buyed Buzzword http://www.adobe.com/acom/buzzword/
and introduced Photoshop Express https://www.photoshop.com/express/landing.html
try basicly the same (even though they fail) - getting money from those who don't want to pay.
So if students are such a influenceable target group that companies such as Autodesk would give anything for to get their personal Interest, way of thinking,... ect why not simply offering a version of lets say Maya or 3dsmax with advertisements (read newsletter/ news) or Personal Data collecting for free?
Because surely no real study would like to work with something like that - every day or there would be no need and some students might actually like that idea - beeing worryfree.
There was once a interesting interview with a Member/ Holder of Adobe but I can't find it anymore anyway the interesting part was that he said that in reality the students would'nt be the real propblem but rather the people who try to sell pirated versions or studios making money with a cracked version of CS.
Adobe can be happy because Gimp the counterpart of Photoshop in the OS scene is yet to crappy to be used in the professional area which usually dictates Universities and schools what to learn for.
Its offtopic. but does anyone know whats up with Gimp? Maybe Im just spoiled by Blender development, but Gimp seems like it should be such a simple project in comparison yet their releases are always so underwhelming...
Hasn't the official policy on Polycount always kind of been "don't ask, don't tell?" I'd rather not see these types of discussions on here. All it does is help ease the conscience of people who are pirating because they can tell themselves "everyone else does it" while irritating people who actually paid for the software because they feel it is unfair. Not a good topic for discussion, IMO.
I think Pior's right, when they sunk Gmax and gave up on MayaPLE they pretty much said this isn't worth our time we're not going to pursue this market or even encourage it.
You wouldn't steal tools from a construction site to start your own business, but you would barrow your dads tools from his garage to use while you're learning.
Don't build your future on shakey ground and don't put your clients at risk. Honestly if you're starting up a business the cost of software and equipment is pretty small compared to the start up costs of other businesses. You can almost save for it, or put it on a credit card.
It's not so astronomically high that it can't be purchased, by that logic we should all be stealing cars, PC's and squatting in mansions.
Replies
PIRACY.
ITS A CRIME.
And I used to use Gmax! GMAX! If that isn't decency, I don't know what is.
I would, and i have! I have a few cars on my HD, not even sure who made them...
Actually, I would, I totally would.
That would be so freakin' awesome.
Someday if 3d printing gets really advanced this will make for an interesting problem.
Why bother? Piracy provides them just as much exposure and does an even better job of keeping potential competition from getting its foot in the door.
Why bother? Just to give of the signal it's OK to download "legal" personal learning editions that are easy to install instead of having to look them up illegally, and have to get a keygenerator that is likely to contain a virus as a bonus.
Having an open door towards people who are interested in your software really pays IMO, just pay when you intend to use the software for anything besides personal use.
Even a small fee would be fine. I'd buy most software if it was around $100, but there's no way I'd be paying more than 300 for a thing I can't try first.
The only type of limited version that would be effective is one that is identical to the full version but is not legal to use for anything but personal work. However, this is pretty much how pirated software is already seen, so all that would change is they loose money from educational sales to students.
If they put out a gimped demo people will still pirate the full version. This applies double to new users who dont even know what features they need and assume that the magic 'make my stuff awesome' button is hidden somewhere in only the most expensive and full featured software.
I prefer pirates.
i am a money generating machine for adobe alias|wavefront and discreet !
if i had a license of my own for all these products they would sell fewer licenses in the end.
but adobe is out of the loop now because i have my own photoshop finally
9 out of 10 demigod players are pirates
Yet everyone gets all mad about the latter while making excuses for the former
That's the reason their software is so easy to crack. It's good business for them if people like us download illegal copies, learn the software and when we get hired our company purchases corporate licenses. The more people are proficient with their software the more standard they will become and more companies will buy them. Microsoft used the same strategy back in the 80s, they basically gave away windows copies to PC manufacturers so their install base would grow and their product become standard.
Personally I'd love to buy these softwares but personal licenses are way too expensive and not really worth it in my opinion.
It is easy to feel superior when you have ended up buying $5,000 worth of software-- especially when the updates are shitty.
i would NEVER pay out of my own pocket for an autodesk or adobe product. autodesk, because every version introduces new bugs and they never fix their old bugs. adobe because they think theyre so high and mighty they can charge an arm and a leg for their cheap ass sowftware that does the same thing as their cheap as software back in 1999. also, their cover art is getting worse and worse.
The point is that many people clearly do not buy said software
I'm curious about "pirated, then got a legal copy from a studio i was working on". There are a lot of hits on that option, so are studios buying you guys home copies of software? You understand that just taking a copy from work and installing it at home is just as illegal as downloading it in the first place right?
No, the point is that $5000 is more than $50 and work software is different than games.
Anyway, if you are looking at the same poll I am looking at, it shows clearly many people DO buy the software once they can afford it.
Denny's just doesn't get you that Porsche.
The people who developed the programs definatly deserve their pay, but honestly using the products to learn free and buying them later, doesn't seem any different than going through the trouble of signing up for a free trail every 30 days.
Because this is not a software engineering forum, it is a game art forum. We are obviously going to be a lot more outspoken about stuff that damages our particular industry.
I guess not having tools would be good for the industry?
Or maybe people act differently because it is entirely different.
The reasons people give for pirating software and for games are similar - overpriced, not terribly good support anyway, only with games they also have the excuse of dodging DRM. The only real difference is that pirating games is larceny and pirating software is grand larceny - either way you're using something under conditions that you are not legally allowed to use it under, you're stealing and that's all there is to it. You can justify it to yourself however you want but that ultimately only makes you feel better
I personally don't really care either way, I don't judge pirates and I have been one myself, but I do find all the excuses people come up with for it pretty sad. It's theft. You do it because you don't want to pay for the product. End of story.
So you should steal that Porsche!
I took out a loan and bought max and a tablet, etc. That's what you do when you want to spend money you don't have.
That's the american way!
Education started, and eventually we actually got a copy each of XSI 5.0. Woo! Then the education ended, and I was stuck somewhere else... but I got an internship there, at a place that used Maya. "Well," I thought, "I'll download it and learn more from home so we don't have to waste work time educating me."
So. They bought in more licenses at work, and I was promised a job. But things turned sour, another skilled intern showed up and the economy only allowed them to hire one person at that period in time. Straws were drawn and I went back home.
Desperate for work, I eventually found a company that I could sneak in some time for from the comfort of my own home. Problem is, they used Max. So I "borrowed" it from a workmate via the magic of the Internet. If we worked in the same building, we could easily share one copy, but unfortunately we're too far away.
Short story, I used XSI illegally, then legally. Then I used Maya illegally, then legally, and now illegally again. And I'm currently using Max illegally, but if things go well I'll use it legally in the future. And frankly I don't see myself buying either for private use any time soon. I kinda am considering Photoshop... but first there's another piece of software I wish to use more and has more promising prospects; FL Studios, for music making. Pay once, free updates for life! Once I can afford that I might start saving up for one of the graphics packages... or a Cintiq.
But first I need a stable job. For the first time in my entire life. Until then, everything I can afford to pay for except food and housing, I consider luxury.
Fuck Yeah! \m/ \m/
(I've since paid off the loan with money earned in the industry using said tools)
That said, I have mixed feeling about piracy.
I DO NOT download games. I don't think there is any reason to. Yes games are expensive when they're released...and many gamers are like kids in a candy store. They must have it NOW. Me, I say most games are worth the price. Others...well, those games suck, were made by poor designers, or their publisher's demands, and will be in the bargain bin in only a couple months. You can wait that long to pay a reasonable price for the experience it gives you. Also, demos. Game demos have saved me TONS of cash, by showing me what games are simply not worth buying...or playing...ever.
That said, I think everyone who downloaded Spore is justified in their actions. I say this as someone who has a legally paid copy of the game, and no longer plays it. The event of making Spore the highest download game in history sent EA a clear message, which is evident in their plans for releasing TheSims3. Stop screwing the consumer, or they will screw you.
I believe software piracy, and the reasons behind it are a different topic...slighty. The game industry is a big, quickly advancing industry. Autodesk is already rolling in the cash from the amount they get from studios purchasing license. The more people educated in the software, the more using it for commercial purposes within legal bounds. I don't think Autodesk, Autodesk, or Autodesk are fearing any financial loss because students and hobbyist choose to download Max, Maya, or XSI. The fact they now own the industry without competition is clear.
Many years ago, I chose to take what I thought was the high road. I bought a legal license to XSI, a new cheaper version for gamers and hobbyist. I loved the software, I loved the work flow it encouraged. It allowed me to work on many projects, some commercial, without guilt. But, as stated above, the industry uses other types of software as their pipeline. Most Max, some Maya. To open up all your opportunities within the industry would require you having knowledge of all three major apps. No one can afford all three. As years past by, and game technology quickly advanced, my legal version of XSI become more and more obsolete. It no longer installs from my original disk, and must be installed from a fixed version, that cannot be found on the company website. Finally the company stopped supporting it, and stopped offering it all together. And then they were bought by Autodesk. In my job search, I've found that my knowledge of the software gets me no where. So, I've been spending my time migrating all of what I know of one application, to the others...which seems like the best strategy given the circumstances. I mean, really, how many get anywhere forcing themselves to use Blender. :P Gmax was a great idea, implemented poorly, and it really sucked. It's how I first learned Max, and learned to hate it. Maya PLE was ok, but not useful. Mod Tool is awesome...but, likely to be sent the way of the other two thanks to Autodesk.
I've always had a legal version of Photoshop 6. I've pirated newer versions of Photoshop in the past, only to find they're MISSING useful features that older versions had. Even the newest versions have disabled thumbnails in Explorer, to encourage the use of Bridge. I have free image viewing software that works great tho.
On one end, people should not pirate software, games, movies just because they can, or think it's cool. On the other, the actions of major companies towards their consumers and hobbyist, and the challenges students face in an educational system that falls behind...encourages it.
Er...i mean...YARR!!!
But see, I didn't take out a loan, and now I have max, and a tablet, etc. I know it's stealing, I guess I'm kind of a dick sometimes, but, well shit, honestly I don't care right now, I just want to learn... and I'm cheap. (actually I didn't steal the physical stuff)
Didn't think as many people would take this guy's approach--->
Side-note: Can you write this stuff off on your taxes? It seems like you should be able to.
"YAR HAR, SHIVER ME DIGITAL TIMBERS!"
If you're self-employed you can write off tons of shit on your taxes, partiall rent, utilities, internet, hardware, software, etc. If you're buying software to do stuff in your free time, and its not you main source of income, then no.
Yeah, it all comes down to personal ethics. If you're fine stealing/pirating whatever, then that's what you'll do. At the time it was important to me that I did things legitimately. If you just want shit and don't care, there's no argument anyone can make that will make any difference.
All I'd want is that you're as understanding when the tables are turned.
That gets really tricky. Its easy for the gov to find a way to kick it off your taxes, they have half a dozen reasons why and some really rough criteria to meet in order for to claim it. Because its such a large amount it sends of giant signal flares and almost always takes weeks to clear up. Now taking your tax return and applying toward the purchase of that software does help to go a long way in covering the cost depending on how big your returns are.
Mammoth software like Max are targeted at professional individuals or companies ; ie folks making money out their use of the program.
A person downloading a non-legit copy of the program is not making a dime out of it. That person is either is a noob, or still learning, or a hobbyist aiming at becoming a professional one day.
In that regard, such individuals don't even fit inside the user target audience the app is tailored for. They are not stealing from Autodesk since Autodesk does not consider them as a source of revenue in the first place anyways! Do you see any advertising on the Autodesk website saying 'Easy to use interface for the driven hobbyist!' ?
To such persons the app should be free in my opinion.
About student versions of the programs : I think this is a huge load of crap. No student should have to pay for a 3D app, It should be provided by the school - there would be a student pricing, but not payed by the student - paid by the university/school as a bulk site license instead.
Officially the system ain't like that (on paper) but in reality this is how it works (except for the uni thing. I don't believe students really buy Max huh) and i think it's fine, and Autodesk knows it very well...
(I don't even mention the dark ages when medium companies where using hacked apps : it's long gone and just not worth the risk).
http://www.devlounge.net/articles/piracy-adobe’s-best-friend
same applies to Office from microsoft,- without the horde of people that wanted the software they used at their office also at home Office wouldn't have the marketshare it has today. The very same reason is why it's gone backwards for Office the last years because OpenOffice the free alternative offers the same functionality people need at home. But it's of course also because many Institutions and Companies want to save Money with avoiding Office in favor of OpenOffice.
Adobe can be happy because Gimp the counterpart of Photoshop in the OS scene is yet to crappy to be used in the professional area which usually dictates Universities and schools what to learn for.
It will be imo. interesting to see how Blender develops in regards of this- it might actually steal a tiny market share or at least licenses from smaller studios. If not already today - I think it will at some point be a serious alternative to some developers and studios.
Besides what has been already discussed here I think that many buisness models from Companies such as Microsoft and Adobe (autodesk probably not) will be changing in the near future.
Booth Microsoft, Google, Adobe, OnLive and many small new commers are already experimenting with cloud computing and Online driven applications (read RIA = rich internet application). The next Office from Microsoft tries to defend exactly what I have been illustrating before - getting the consumer and casual users back from OpenOffice and Pirated software by releasing the Software with Ads or small fees per use/month,...
Same for Adobe who buyed Buzzword
http://www.adobe.com/acom/buzzword/
and introduced Photoshop Express
https://www.photoshop.com/express/landing.html
try basicly the same (even though they fail) - getting money from those who don't want to pay.
So if students are such a influenceable target group that companies such as Autodesk would give anything for to get their personal Interest, way of thinking,... ect why not simply offering a version of lets say Maya or 3dsmax with advertisements (read newsletter/ news) or Personal Data collecting for free?
Because surely no real study would like to work with something like that - every day or there would be no need and some students might actually like that idea - beeing worryfree.
There was once a interesting interview with a Member/ Holder of Adobe but I can't find it anymore anyway the interesting part was that he said that in reality the students would'nt be the real propblem but rather the people who try to sell pirated versions or studios making money with a cracked version of CS.
Its offtopic. but does anyone know whats up with Gimp? Maybe Im just spoiled by Blender development, but Gimp seems like it should be such a simple project in comparison yet their releases are always so underwhelming...
+1
You wouldn't steal tools from a construction site to start your own business, but you would barrow your dads tools from his garage to use while you're learning.
Don't build your future on shakey ground and don't put your clients at risk. Honestly if you're starting up a business the cost of software and equipment is pretty small compared to the start up costs of other businesses. You can almost save for it, or put it on a credit card.
It's not so astronomically high that it can't be purchased, by that logic we should all be stealing cars, PC's and squatting in mansions.
I also agree with AZ.
right, because that would deny assets for that construction business.
instead of the guy who rightfully owned the tools, you have them.
thats wrong.