Who else thinks gears of war 2 had awesome writing?
polycounter lvl 17
This is totally irrelevant, but it vaguely relates to videogames so indulge me, alright?
I could write a lengthy essay on how insufferably arrogant the general gaming public is about the content of videogames, seeing as it's something that i always find pretty ridiculous and there's quite a lot of material to cover.
Basically, videogame fans, more than any other area of entertainment, seem to think if a game is not in line with their own personal expectations it is a tremendous failure.
-Resident evil 5 is bad because you can't move while shooting, as if the developers designed and balanced a traditional third person shooter and then just ran out of programming time or something, instead of it being a part of the game design.
-MGS4 has a ridiculous plot, as opposed to just heavily stylized (and melodramatic!) storytelling. This one always gets me -- would you go to a broadway musical and then come home and write forum posts about how nobody, i mean nobody, would break into song at a time like that?
-[your favorite game's sequel] is a horrible game!
But really, i want to focus on one particular game for the sake of illustration. Gears of War 2. It had an AWESOME plot.
Whereas GOW1 was a stilted, misfired attempt at a serious war story in the midst of an unintentionally hilarious setting, GOW2 took all of the absurdity of the Gears universe and ran with it. This is a world where the military has invested all of their money in hulking men who's armored suits (and heads) shrug off bullets like rainwater but are instantly cleft in two by a small, rudimentary chainsaw. This is a world where nothing is streamlined or efficient, everything seems to run on diesel fuel, and if it moves, you can (and are advised) to gib it.
What the hell purpose would serious, well written, thought provoking dialogue have served in this world? It's spectacularly ridiculous -- why shouldn't the characters be just as over the top? And so we have cheesy one liners, we have gritty war dialogue with the GRIT cranked to 10000%. We have a two man team abandoning their mission and jeopardizing the entire fate of humanity to preform a head on assault on the capital city of the monstrous enemies (instead of just sneaking in disguised) because one of them was upset, and his bro wanted to help him get revenge. Cause that's just what bros do.
Does anyone here really, really, think that the writer was the ONLY person in the world who couldn't tell what they were writing was silly? Maybe, just maybe, the game is ridiculous and over the top on purpose. So why say the story sucks just because you can't take it seriously? Games can have deep, subtle plots, games can be art -- but not every game that isn't is an accident or a failure.
I could write a lengthy essay on how insufferably arrogant the general gaming public is about the content of videogames, seeing as it's something that i always find pretty ridiculous and there's quite a lot of material to cover.
Basically, videogame fans, more than any other area of entertainment, seem to think if a game is not in line with their own personal expectations it is a tremendous failure.
-Resident evil 5 is bad because you can't move while shooting, as if the developers designed and balanced a traditional third person shooter and then just ran out of programming time or something, instead of it being a part of the game design.
-MGS4 has a ridiculous plot, as opposed to just heavily stylized (and melodramatic!) storytelling. This one always gets me -- would you go to a broadway musical and then come home and write forum posts about how nobody, i mean nobody, would break into song at a time like that?
-[your favorite game's sequel] is a horrible game!
But really, i want to focus on one particular game for the sake of illustration. Gears of War 2. It had an AWESOME plot.
Whereas GOW1 was a stilted, misfired attempt at a serious war story in the midst of an unintentionally hilarious setting, GOW2 took all of the absurdity of the Gears universe and ran with it. This is a world where the military has invested all of their money in hulking men who's armored suits (and heads) shrug off bullets like rainwater but are instantly cleft in two by a small, rudimentary chainsaw. This is a world where nothing is streamlined or efficient, everything seems to run on diesel fuel, and if it moves, you can (and are advised) to gib it.
What the hell purpose would serious, well written, thought provoking dialogue have served in this world? It's spectacularly ridiculous -- why shouldn't the characters be just as over the top? And so we have cheesy one liners, we have gritty war dialogue with the GRIT cranked to 10000%. We have a two man team abandoning their mission and jeopardizing the entire fate of humanity to preform a head on assault on the capital city of the monstrous enemies (instead of just sneaking in disguised) because one of them was upset, and his bro wanted to help him get revenge. Cause that's just what bros do.
Does anyone here really, really, think that the writer was the ONLY person in the world who couldn't tell what they were writing was silly? Maybe, just maybe, the game is ridiculous and over the top on purpose. So why say the story sucks just because you can't take it seriously? Games can have deep, subtle plots, games can be art -- but not every game that isn't is an accident or a failure.
Replies
I think for me the best story in a game was Mass Effect. You don't hear much about this game anymore, but I had a blast with it. It didn't feel over bearing, it had a nice pace (depending on how you played I guess).
Being pissed off about not being able to move in shoot in RE5 is more like yelling at the TV during contrived crap situations in the latest Saw movie (they're also at 5 now aren't they?).
Oh and for an example of better writing that still fits the style of gears of war? Look at what they do with the god of war franchise. The plot is interesting enough, they find plenty of opportunities to make the main character badass (frankly doing a much better job than they do with the COG) and the characters have simple, yet believable motivations.
Haha, no.
The style of gears of war as you imagine it, or the style of gears of war as it is written and produced?
Because God of War has a very different tone than gears.
Ugh? You don't like shining examples of game design? One the pinnacle of the oldschool online action-rpg, and the other one of the best designed games in recent memory?
Seems to me you're arguing the old "you can't appreciate it" angle, which is mostly wrong. If enough people whine it means the dev messed up, not that those people are "insufferably arrogant".
I'm more specifically commenting on the people who expect it to be something it isn't than the plain old 'can't appreciate it'. If you go looking for cliche'd, campy space marines and find Gears isn't up to par then sure, the Devs messed up. But people expected it to be a gritty military shooter ala cod4 and continue to critique it as such are more of what i'm getting at. Expecting a product to deliver is one thing, expecting a product to deliver something entirely unrelated to its subject is another.
Personally i didn't think there were enough weapons in gran turismo, but you know.
And the actual writing is pretty awful. GoW2 moreso than its predecessor thanks to the whole "Dom's wife" subplot, which was especially cringeworthy. But then, that's not what the game's about. No one plays games like that for the story or writing in the same way people don't watch action films for the same reason.
If you want a truly great script (and voice acting!) go play Bloodlines. Then you can see what DiMaggio can do with good writing as opposed to GoW's attempt
I agree with that. I find that when I go back to an old game the story is really bad but at the time I thought it was good. I guess it also shows how we are evolving.
Could have done without the Maria subplot, though. It felt tacked on and unnecessary.
And in the following combat Dom seems oblivious to the fact that he had shot his zombie wife in the face. He's like "dibbs!" as he grabs ammo.
I wish he'd said "sup bitches!!!" as he shot his wife in the face and executed a perfect active reload.
http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/470146#
I've just been waiting for my Queers of War 2 fix, anyone got anymore cool stuff like this that ridicules us?
http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/469184
It's the gameplay that is the interesting part.
I don't care if ts a badly written as xena warrior princess or hercules as long as its fun to play
The first gears was kind of fun, but It crashed a bit and would keep losing my profile.
apparently 'cole train' is a codeword for group bumming?
You want an example of genuinely great writing in a video game? And there have been a few examples, but a game that really grabs you and rubs your face in it and shouts "yeah bitch, check out my great writing!"
It's never been rivaled. Given the sheer density of the writing alone, not to mention the philosophical musings and genuine pathos, I think it'll probably be a long, long time yet before it's bested.
Thank you, Army of Darkness is a perfect example of what i'm getting at. Would anyone here critique AoD for its lack of subtle plotting or believable characters?
Just because Gears has an action-film standard plot in an action-film standard game doesn't make it a good plot, merely a fitting one.
They did used to give me straight up cash, but I would go out and spend it on sweets anyway, so this is better for both of us.
"I just can't quit you." - Marcus to Dom
Did you miss the point to this thread. You shall be shunned from ever setting foot in this thread again!
Oh and as for the bromance... Marcus will come to your house... headbutt you to the floor... and take a dump on your chest.
So wait, let me get this straight. A plot which is fitting and appropriate for the subject is bad, but a deep, intellectual plot which was not whatsoever appropriate for the game would be good?
I like to think that when you're taking multiple elements of entertainment and combining them together them all fitting properly is a decently high priority.
Codeman, not reading posts is the #1 way to be cool.
And that bromance was touching, see 'We have a two man team abandoning their mission and jeopardizing the entire fate of humanity to preform a head on assault on the capital city of the monstrous enemies (instead of just sneaking in disguised) because one of them was upset, and his bro wanted to help him get revenge. Cause that's just what bros do.' above.
Only better instance of bromance in videogaming was snake and otacon's manly hi5 handshake hug after emma dies in mgs2.
Actually i didn't even read your post, tbh, i'll go back and argue with you later if you're so starved for attention. Why are you taking a thread about GEAYS OF WAR so personally?
I love action movies and 90% of the time I'll gladly ignore the plot and enjoy the sheer style of execution - it's the core point of such films and it's the point of games in the same vein. Take Shoot 'Em Up as a good recent example; stylish and action-packed to the very last but the plot was ridiculous nonsense (although, the actual script was pretty good - unlike GoW).
Same way that the plot for Army of Darkness is pathetic but the script and cheesy B-movie atmosphere help pull it off. I can and will forgive and overlook a stupid/cliche plot so long as the script is well written and entertaining - and GoW didn't manage that for me. It's writing falls on it's arse and as a result the plot falls down with it is pretty much the point I'm making.
Either way, it was an extremely FUN game and the writing matched the universe the game was held within.
I'm with Cojax on Mass Effect being best game story ever told.
There's nothing spectacular story wise.
If I were to guess, I would say they decided the entire art direction of the game, and had a bunch of concepts and characters nailed down before they even had a script. Then took a look at all the badass art they made, and tried to write a script around that.
It's still one of my favorite games, but the story isn't anything that stands out in my mind as being outstanding.
COD4 beat this both gameplay and storywise imo.
[ame]
i read every day, i love to read, but i dont want to see Hemingway or Tolstoy in my games, i just want to play something.
"smells like toejam and ass and chesse and ass and shit and butholes in here"
my favorite quote from Madame Bovary one of the greatest books of all time.oh wait no it was from gears, i get the two mixed up all the time.