I first noticed the barrel on the end was much too skinny. With a little google research, it looks like you need some more details on the side and bottom (though the bottom is less important). I'm sure you could squeeze all of this on one 512 map.
I had thought the barrel was too fat at first, although you're probably right.
The stock takes up ~50% of one of the 512 maps and it still looks pretty low-res. Although I bet I could squeeze the magazine map into one of the others, or just scale it down (why do I need a 512 for something you rarely see upclose?)
But yeah, I realise I'm missing quite a few details, but this is my first serious model in 3ds and most good reference I could find was of the older Liberty model, most of which is totally different from this one.
No, if it were one 512 map, this thing would really only look good from a distance, if that, and then all the extra details in the model wouldn't be needed anyways.
The stock looks low-res enough as is, and it's as big as it possibly can be whilst still inside the game's texture size limit.
If it's a in game view model then you can delete the faces that wont be seen - and more importantly (because of the size of the textures) not map those faces. I can see a seam on the stock where the wood grain is in a V shape. (forgive me if this is how real wood stocks look and everything I've said you already know/did)
Sorry but i dont think this looks very good at all, if you want some serious gun crits you should post it here: http://cdg.csnation.net/viewforum.php?f=19 Polycount isnt really the place to post weapons and stuff like that, most of these guys do character art. Im not trying to say you shouldnt post here or anything tho, do as you wish.
hey EQ please don't tell me you visit that forum...I click on any page of the top 4 pages and I find swear words and immature dicks everywhere. Hardly a good first impression as I was gonna post up for crits on my weapons pack,but Id rather take my chances on polycount with you,not so immature nutters .
Anyway Kitteh,its a start but I think it could be much better,firstly, yeah 3 512 textures is far to exsessive for this. A good artist would be able to fit what you have got on a single 512 and not loose much detail.
Secondly you need to push your highlights more and make them of varing consistency.Also im noticing the use of black and white for shadows this is a nono...try and get more colour into it....as the artist words are....no black is ever a pure black.
Id like to see you,lighten all the black areas up an add more detail,while doing this think which directions the light will come from and highlight the areas that will be hit directly by this light..add gloss,gradients etc and hopefully your new detail won't get sucked into the pure black you seem to have going now.
I DO visit the CDG forums. And no I am not a idiotic dick face like a number of people there, but do you have any idea how high quality the work there is. Stoke is one of the best skinners I have ever seen. Jennifer!! is the best weapons animator I've ever seen, sas.stu is amazing at modeling as well as Darkstorn, HellSpike, Silvio Dante, and the many other skilled modelers there. Give them a chance, the Work in Progress section is where the real gold is found (at least the cdg gold).
Okies ive had a closer look around and maybe I jumped to conclusions,but its still one of the least well moderated forums ive seen in awhile...though to be honest im not much of a forum person...normally just here and luking at CA.org and CGchat.com.
Also ive heard/seen the work of some of those people you mentioned,the best have appeared on many top CS:S review sites and I can't deny they are damn good at what they do ...but I also can't stand people mouthing off for attention or using bad language for no reason or post just to say how much someones mod sucks.
Meh I guess if I ignore most of the comments there and jsut look at the good stuff something useful will come out of it.
Edit:- or maybe im to stuck up for my own good and really should take a chill pill
i'm sorry to dissapoint you, but you are WRONG, and your attitude here is definatly keeping you from improving your art, i would bet you money that that texture could be done on onw 512, perhaps smaller, 256x512 and fit well more detail than you have going into it. but if you insist that you have done it as best as it can possibly be done.. then who are we to argue with you.
If the model is only being used in first person view, just spend all your texture space on the top, left side, and any details that are going to be closer to the camera. I modeled and textured all of the weapons for a console FPS, and our texture limit was much less than 1 512. Granted, you're modding a PC game, but you should still be economic in your texture useage. No point in wasting texture space on the bottom or details on the front of the gun. Doesn't mean you should ignore those parts, because you never know how the gun is going to be animated (ex: pieces you can't see regularly might be visible when doing a reload), and you probably shouldn't delete polys as well.
I also agree with AfroLeft, that seam with the wood grain should be fixed, since it's right there in front of the camera. I'd do a continuous map of the top faces there and attach them to the faces on the left side to avoid seams.
Looks good for a first-pass Kitteh. I think it could use some more "grunge." Scratches, dents, stains etc. As it is right now, it's a very clean, yet uninteresting weapon.
And I agree with what others have said. Three 512 maps are waaaaaaay too much for a HL1 weapon model. In my opinion, You could very well compile them all into a 1024 map.
j4polaris: Heh, a single 1024x1024 has four times the area of a single 512x512. 3 512x512 maps is actually less texture space than a single 1024 :P
Kitteh: Oh, right... I guess you're an industry professional? Chris Holden (cholden) and Rhinokey are both game artists by trade, as am I. But never mind what we say, you know best, I'm sure!
Kitteh: Oh, right... I guess you're an industry professional? Chris Holden (cholden) and Rhinokey are both game artists by trade, as am I. But never mind what we say, you know best, I'm sure!
[/ QUOTE ]
I think that you guys are jumping on this man about texture space when what you should be concentrating on taking what he has done and try to work with him. I think that the amount of detail he has it could be on a 512x512 mesh if skinned right. For a first person weapon with a stock that big I would agree that a 512x512 mesh is inadequate, these days a 1024 or more is standard. I think that the skin looks pretty bland and could use some more detail, you metal is bland and your wood is blurry. Try to skin it with a constand light source comming from one direction not wherever you think it looks good. Best of luck with you next texture. My best advice would be to keep practicing
PS: The quality of the skin could also reflect the UV maps because the model from first glance looks mediocre
we are not jumping on him, it was stated several times that the level of detail he is getting could be done easily on a much smaller space, he in turned implied that we were all wrong and theres no way that could be done. which is a very ignorant stance to be taken,
I wish him the best, but the first thing you need to learn, is that you need to learn,
If done rite you can get away with very small textures on first person weapons. In fact all the weapons on consols use 512 or smaller. The thing is that people quickly forget that not all the detail you see is really there, alot of it is made up but the viewers mind because they want to belive it looks better than it does. It doesnt take that many pixels to make a player think that they have alot more than they do.
Try making a few things using one 64x texture map. Learn to use every pixel to push a detail and then you can say what can and cant be done in a 512x texture.
I see where you are comming from sure, but I do disagree with you, consoles use everything lower res because they have to. I was also refering to PC in my "standard" comment. Sorry for the confusion. I mean I can understand that 512x512 is exceptable with you have a 512 for a spec/normal/difuse/height, but when it's a game like UT2k4, HL, HL2 you need to paint "some" lighting and the details yourself so higher resolution is required. Don't take this as me saying your wrong all I am saying is that I disagree with you and above is my reasoning.
back, i am not opposed to 1024 or even larger textures being used when needed, but this is a simple gun with very few details, the majority of the detail i see is the wood grain in the stock,
i don't mean to be bashing kits work, on the whole it is a decent model, and a decent texture, and if he woulda simply said "yes i'm sure i coulda done it in less space, but this is what i wanted to do" then it woulda been fine. but blatantly saying it was impossible, is the quickest way possible to stunt his growth as an artist.
i'm sorry to bump this.. butI agree this could have all been done in much less space, probably 2 maps at most, and i'm sorry for being so ignorant and naive. this is the very first time i've modelled a gun for an fps, or unwrapped anything, and the first time skinning my own model (i rushed this skin )
no problemm 99% of sucess is makking errors, you just have to know when you have made one in order to learn,, my god i can't even count the stupid mistakes i have made in my years at this, be sure to keep us updated of progres
Replies
It really doesn't look like it needs 3 x 512x512 maps, though. Any chance of seeing the flats?
I first noticed the barrel on the end was much too skinny. With a little google research, it looks like you need some more details on the side and bottom (though the bottom is less important). I'm sure you could squeeze all of this on one 512 map.
The stock takes up ~50% of one of the 512 maps and it still looks pretty low-res. Although I bet I could squeeze the magazine map into one of the others, or just scale it down (why do I need a 512 for something you rarely see upclose?)
But yeah, I realise I'm missing quite a few details, but this is my first serious model in 3ds and most good reference I could find was of the older Liberty model, most of which is totally different from this one.
The stock looks low-res enough as is, and it's as big as it possibly can be whilst still inside the game's texture size limit.
Anyway Kitteh,its a start but I think it could be much better,firstly, yeah 3 512 textures is far to exsessive for this. A good artist would be able to fit what you have got on a single 512 and not loose much detail.
Secondly you need to push your highlights more and make them of varing consistency.Also im noticing the use of black and white for shadows this is a nono...try and get more colour into it....as the artist words are....no black is ever a pure black.
Id like to see you,lighten all the black areas up an add more detail,while doing this think which directions the light will come from and highlight the areas that will be hit directly by this light..add gloss,gradients etc and hopefully your new detail won't get sucked into the pure black you seem to have going now.
hope this helps
john
Also ive heard/seen the work of some of those people you mentioned,the best have appeared on many top CS:S review sites and I can't deny they are damn good at what they do ...but I also can't stand people mouthing off for attention or using bad language for no reason or post just to say how much someones mod sucks.
Meh I guess if I ignore most of the comments there and jsut look at the good stuff something useful will come out of it.
Edit:- or maybe im to stuck up for my own good and really should take a chill pill
John
I also agree with AfroLeft, that seam with the wood grain should be fixed, since it's right there in front of the camera. I'd do a continuous map of the top faces there and attach them to the faces on the left side to avoid seams.
And I agree with what others have said. Three 512 maps are waaaaaaay too much for a HL1 weapon model. In my opinion, You could very well compile them all into a 1024 map.
Kitteh: Oh, right... I guess you're an industry professional? Chris Holden (cholden) and Rhinokey are both game artists by trade, as am I. But never mind what we say, you know best, I'm sure!
Kitteh: Oh, right... I guess you're an industry professional? Chris Holden (cholden) and Rhinokey are both game artists by trade, as am I. But never mind what we say, you know best, I'm sure!
[/ QUOTE ]
I think that you guys are jumping on this man about texture space when what you should be concentrating on taking what he has done and try to work with him. I think that the amount of detail he has it could be on a 512x512 mesh if skinned right. For a first person weapon with a stock that big I would agree that a 512x512 mesh is inadequate, these days a 1024 or more is standard. I think that the skin looks pretty bland and could use some more detail, you metal is bland and your wood is blurry. Try to skin it with a constand light source comming from one direction not wherever you think it looks good. Best of luck with you next texture. My best advice would be to keep practicing
PS: The quality of the skin could also reflect the UV maps because the model from first glance looks mediocre
I wish him the best, but the first thing you need to learn, is that you need to learn,
Try making a few things using one 64x texture map. Learn to use every pixel to push a detail and then you can say what can and cant be done in a 512x texture.
i don't mean to be bashing kits work, on the whole it is a decent model, and a decent texture, and if he woulda simply said "yes i'm sure i coulda done it in less space, but this is what i wanted to do" then it woulda been fine. but blatantly saying it was impossible, is the quickest way possible to stunt his growth as an artist.