[UDK] - Hallway, portfolio project

Rhoutermans

[LATEST]



Hi all,

Got a new deadline on my portfolio so I will be doing these 'small' environments every 2/3 weeks and hopefully have something nice in the end to show off on my portfolio Any feedback is greatly appreciated!

I will use this thread to keep track of how I'm doing and for self-motivation

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Goals for this project:
- Finishing it in 2/3 weeks, taking some days off if I have to.
- Using a concept for reference
- Modular where possible
- Looking for references for every item that needs to be done.
- Improving on texturing
- Stop being afraid to use some color!
- A focus on lighting
- Using time efficiently, not wasting too much time on modelling
- Simple, but high quality geometry
- Paying a close attention to scale and composition
- Expanding on the concept, what else could there be inside the offices?
- Put more time into presentation

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Just to wrap my head around it and sticking to it this time..

Workflow;
- Concept breakdown for modular usage
- A blockout, get the sense of scale right
- Working on modular pieces first
- High to Low poly where needed
- Props
- Lighting
- Finishing touches
- Presentation

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First off, this awesome concept by http://khaleev-.cghub.com/ and a breakdown (for anyone who can actually read my handwriting) :



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Really looking forward to starting this after looking for more references for each item in the concept! More tomorrow..

Rhoutermans

First blockout, checking proportions;

PogoP

Looks a bit big atm! The door is double the size of the character.

Also, that concept looks like the study room from Community :P

brandoom

Yea, everything looks really big as PogoP mentioned.

Figure that your character is 6'.. an average door is 8' high, ceiling is probably ~13', hallway is probably around 13 as well.

Rhoutermans

And here I was always told size didn't matter, but you guys are right I feel like most of the scale was right compared to each other, but not to the characters indeed, did some scaling, feels a bit better now I hope. Also made the hallway a bit longer. The Community thing would make a good cross over, where someone from the group finally snaps :P

Broadway

That's a cool concept.

It's still off a bit I think. In the concept the width of the hallway looks to be a little under 2 door heights, and it's closer to 3 door heights in your blockout. Also the wall in the concept looks like it's about 1.5 door heights tall, and it's a bit more it blockout.

Rhoutermans

Thanks for the feedback on scale, hopefully a bit better now

djgardner

looks good so far.

Rhoutermans

working on the first wall

AkiRa

Looks good so far but I'am pretty sure you will be get some problems with the scale later on. I'am 6.5 feet tall and if I stand in a doorframe its less than half a head taller than me. Your doorframes are easily 4 heads taller than the player character which is a bit big in my opinion. And based on the concept -which is really well choose- I assume you are going for a real world scale.

As doorframes are a good indicator of the overall scale, your assets will also be too big later. Maybe its just the perspective (size looks usually a bit different from the 1st person view of course) but personally I find it really huge.

I would say you sould take a look at those threads:

http://forums.epicgames.com/threads/590005-List-of-generic-sizes?highlight=Standard%20Player%20Height%20UDK%20Units

http://forums.epicgames.com/threads/714868-Standard-Player-Height-in-UDK-Units

As for the wall I think the color matches good with the concept but your damage looks a bit squashy since it looks some kind of pushed in instead of broken in a way modern concrete would break.
Take a look at some reference pictures and try to replicate the cracks and the damage as good as you can to really sell that stuff.
As I'am also a beginner, I can't give such a competent critique as a pro could do but I try my best to help.
Just my two cents^^

But you are on the right track and if you fix issues like the scale at the beginning, you won't have to struggle with that later on since scale is one of the things which can really ruin a good scene.

Keep it up!

Rhoutermans

AkiRa, thanks for ur feedback, some good points in there

I've been playing with the scale a lot now. Trying to make it match up to the character but still staying true to the concept...it's not matching up atm indeed. When I went into first person mode it just didn't make sense, when looking at the stock character he felt really small. But I'll see what happens if I scale the door more correctly to the character, and perhaps lowering the windows just a bit. I feel like getting the scale down first is important too.

The wall was a first test and it could be better. For each object I found ref but somehow I skipped on that when I started to sculpt the damage in the wall. I'll go back and bake a few new bakes, thanks for the feedback

dissonance

I ran into something like this when I was messing around with UDK a while ago, and IIRC the height of the player changes depending on gamemode, so the height of the eyes in the model you have standing in the doorway may not actually be the height of the player's eyes when you jump into the game. It's really weird and I can't remember for the life of me what exactly I did to get it correct. Have a look here and Ctrl+F for "game type" to get directions to the dropdown box in question: try out different modes to see which one feels best.

Rhoutermans

dissonance, I've checked out different game modes and I think I'll stick with FrameworkGame, just a flying cam, no hud etc, pretty handy anyway. I think I got the scale down now..Gonna think out some more stuff before really working on the right windows / doors. Thanks for the feedback so far, very helpfull!

In the meantime here's an update on the left wall;



Gonna use the scratched surfaces to chip away the paint on those places..some real life ref was pretty much needed, like this one:
Now that I'm looking at it again I might push the sculpt a little bit more

Rhoutermans

A little moar damage, like so!



/spam mode off

Rhoutermans

and the result, just can't stop working on this

Just updated the front wall with the correct normal/ texture

KartoonHead

You're being very wasteful in your approach to the wall. It's very uncommon for a long flat wall to be a single mesh with its own textures and high-poly sculpt. If you were to instead use tileable textures with trims and decals you'd be able to create an infinite number of vastly different walls from a very small number of graphical assets. Huge chunky bits of damage can be done using a mixture of low-poly modelling techniques, decals, and vertex painting.

Edit - and the normals on the corner of your wall are a bit broken at the moment

Rhoutermans

KartoonHead, I'm gonna mix it up I do have a repeatable texture, but using it on 4 out 6 wall parts, (in this case it's one mesh that has 3 textures, one of them tiles on the empty parts) . But I'm gonna use decals on the pieces of damage that aren't really that big anyway, does sound like a better plan and I'll only have two textures for the wall. But the front one does have the hole modeled out a bit so I'm keeping that texture. So here's the new plan for my lunchbreak tomorrow!



I'll also go back and check on the corner, cheers!

DWalker

A hole as deep as the big one will expose the interior details of the wall, and would probably have gone entirely through the wall. You could probably simulate this well placing a shadow box with a pre-rendered scene behind the hole - a bit of work, but the results may well be worth it. Also, bullets do not always strike walls straight-on. In this particular scene, it looks like most or all of the bullets came from in front of the short wall; the holes in the long wall will be at increasingly oblique angles, and some of them might well be exit holes.

Take a look at some bullet penetration videos - aside from the fun, they can show you what happens to real-world materials when hit by bullets.

Rhoutermans

DWalker, I like the idea of adding something more to see behind the first wall. I'll try something simple to see how it would work, tho I wouldn't be making the hole too big. Also a nice catch about the angle of the bulletholes on the side of the wall, added that in there

And maybe you guys can solve a mystery for me that's been bugging me the last two days:

Lightmaps that show seams from certain angles..(Build with production settings and one simple omni)

Rhoutermans

Got some advice and fixed it, was a mistake in my second UV channel. Doh.

Rhoutermans

working on the ceiling now, still need to add some missing tiles/ wires etc

DWalker

The tiles seem a bit flat at the moment. In addition to the surface of the tiles (which seem to have a normal map), the supporting beams should have some depth. Also, while the tiles themselves tend to be white, the beams are usually darker, and have a definite glossy sheen when compared to the matte texture of the tiles. Finally, the beams seem too thick for the size of the tiles.

Rhoutermans

DWalker, Cheers for the ref Modeled out the support pieces and made em more plastic like. Wasted a lot of time messing around with lightmass today

Rhoutermans

Trying out some textures

biofrost

If you want to get the lighting right early on. I would replace the purple and gray material with a generic gray one of your own. that way light mass is not bouncing the purple color around.

Keep it up!

Rhoutermans

Cheers, replaced most of the wall / floor pieces to get some better results with lightmass..Got a lot of revisiting to do, but want to start working on the props soon

Any tips on design or lighting etc is greatly appreciated

DWalker

The seam in the carpet really stands out. Most carpets now have carefully hidden seams.

easterislandnick

I think you need to look closely at he scale of your scene, the ceiling tiles and damage are huge. It makes the ceiling feel very low and claustrophobic.

Rhoutermans

You guys are totally right, will fix the ceiling today, I'll try 5 or 6 tiles instead of 4 wanted to redo the ceiling anyway and model out everything properly

Subtle 1rony

The ceiling in your concept feels more lofty than what you have here. Overall, comparing to the concepts, the concepts look a bit higher. I agree with easterislandnick, it does feel claustrophobic

Rhoutermans

Right, rebuild the ceiling and made the wooden wall on the right a bit less chunky.



Tomorrow working on the first couple props, starting with the ceiling lights and window blinds! Looking forward to it~

Rhoutermans

Redid the lighting and added the first prop, window blinds and office ceiling.

dissonance

Ceiling's looking much better.

leopadua3d

Hi Rhoutermans,

I think your scene is coming along. Its certainly much better than it was a few days ago.
I'm not totally convinced by the door dimensions you opted. It could help if your preview camera was closer to that of the player, but anyhow, it looks a bit too wide.

You may want to check the following image for some reference on the proportions:
http://www.hmidoors.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/buildupframes.jpg

I think the only other thing that currently "stands out" is the wall texture. I know it has been said before, so I will leave you some links for your reference. What gets to me is that your current holes are from a metal wall, as it seem to have absorved most of the impact and bent. On concrete/brick walls, the impact shatters the concrete instead of bending it. Perhaps, as it has been suggested, you could solve the problem by using a "perfect wall" texture and a lerp with a map to blend between the perfect wall and the holes, or decals.

http://static4.depositphotos.com/1001123/312/i/950/depositphotos_3125448-Hole--wall--concrete.jpg
http://compressedsoilblocks.com/ballistic-tests/
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-gm_r9JyQp0s/T2pQx3oaFsI/AAAAAAAABO4/Ir-2_-Dw3N0/s1600/kandahar+031.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_JU8PMGxsYnc/SWGCA52Gd4I/AAAAAAAAAfc/0lkVHhVzAek/s400/a175_afghan.jpg

Keep up the good work. It is coming along.

Rhoutermans

Thanks for the feedback, I'm planning on re doing a lot of the texturing including the wall.

Also fixed the height of the door~

DWalker

The glass doesn't seem right, especially not for modern safety glass. That breaks into small pieces, with the laminate holding many of the pieces to the frame:


The blinds in the window should probably be behind the table. Try to work out in your head the sequence of events; figure out where the explosion occurred, where the props were at the time, and determine what happened as the explosion went off - blast wave, followed by light debris, followed by heavier objects. If the explosion was at the hole in the wall, then the box directly under the hole should have been tossed aside.

The table looks a bit too simple - I'd expect braces or beams to support the table legs.

Rhoutermans

Prop update ..



Worked on the glass:



Cheers for all the tips, keeps pushing me
Also updated the table with some support pieces on the bottom ~

nick2730

Looks good so far keep pushing it, like others have said dont worry about lighting till textures are in place or it will mess it up. I really like the wood texture and you material definition looks very good as well

leopadua3d

Hi Rhoutermans,

You've been quite busy I take. Good progress.

I have my doubts about the window glass texture tho. I believe it lacks rhythm and purpose. What bothers me is that the fractures are almost the same size and don't seem to have a connection to the polygonal shape at all.

I think you would be better off using maps to achieve the broken glass texture, and that has the benefit of lowering your poly counts.

What I can point you to think about is that when you break a window, it will have high frequency shards close to the point of impact, and then as the impact wave travels the frequency reduces, but as it bounces on the frame and comes back, sometimes it also gives high frequency shards by frame mount.

In an attempt to illustrate my point and help you towards the shader solution, I have done a draft shader based on an image. Forgive me for the draft look, but I think the point comes across.


Keep up man, this is getting better and better!

All the best,

Joshua Stubbles

The broken glass right now just doesn't have enough geo definition. It's very cartoonish in how it's broken. Don't be afraid to use more geometry to better define it. Either that or just use a texture w/alpha like Leo suggests.

Rhoutermans

I've improved on the glass as suggested, some more effort into the material and texture, Liking it a lot better now!

leopadua3d

Cool Rhoutermans!

Getting better by the days. keep up, keep growing.

Rhoutermans

adding smaller props to the hallway, more glass some pipes and cables...also storages boxes

leopadua3d

Hi Rhoutermans,

Looks like you've been progressing. Lemme ask you this, are you using real-world units for measuring? The reason I ask, is because at least on this camera/view, the PC seems rather big.

Other than that, good progress. keep up.

Cheers

Rhoutermans

Leo > I've eyeballed the props to scale, perhaps not the best method I've come to realize now The PC looks too fat to even be a hightower so I'll scale him down a bit

DWalker

Strangely, the back of your PC seems more detailed and accurate than the front.

The PC also seems strangely pristine for having been blown-up. While the following pictures might be carrying things a bit far, I think it should show some damage.

Rhoutermans

I could add some dents/scratches, I think it was only thrown around, but the decal on the ground tells a different story indeed so I'm replacing that one with some bullet damage.

But the decal is only projecting on the floor, not on the two panels beneath the PC which is strange..I could project it onto the pc tho

btw, thanks for all the feedback so far, really helpfull I just need to get this done the right way and hopefully improve some more

Rhoutermans

Still so much to do but atleast some progress

Shrike

hmm I think the colors are not right.

Neon tubes usually give out pretty white / cold light, also even if they were yellow, your PC stands out with the only cold toned object in the scene which is distracting

It looks really warm and inviting right now, cold light would bring the destroyed stuff a lot better. Maybe get a complementary contrast

Asset wise it looks really nice, Just dont like those rectangles on the bottom , cant really read what they are.

Edit: Looking at the concept - it has a complementary contrast in lighting,
purple on top and yellow accents. It gives a very different mood than you have right now.

Rhoutermans

edit---

Rhoutermans

Got the time last couple of days to work on this some more. Gonna make an old printer and some random paper stuffs on the floor here and there. Any advice on how to pimp this some more is appreciated Really want to finish this over the next 2 weeks